Ted Kennedy Open Thread
I’m eager to hear your thoughts on the passing of Ted Kennedy. It’s tempting to imagine that his death could prod the Senate into action on health care reform. It would be an extraordinary, and perhaps fitting, historical irony if Kennedy’s death provided the final moral impetus to accomplish one of the primary causes to which he dedicated his life.
Here’s a quick roundup of info and opinion:
* Robert Reich, on Kennedy’s special blend of passion and pragmatism.
* The Wonk Room ponders what might have been if Kennedy had been well enough to mediate the Senate bipartisan “gang of six” talks about health care reform.
* Here’s our big profile of Kennedy.
* The New York Times’s portrait of Kennedy, the person:
He was a Rabelaisian figure in the Senate and in life, instantly recognizable by his shock of white hair, his florid, oversize face, his booming Boston brogue, his powerful but pained stride. He was a celebrity, sometimes a self-parody, a hearty friend, an implacable foe, a man of large faith and large flaws, a melancholy character who persevered, drank deeply and sang loudly. He was a Kennedy.
* President Obama’s statement honors his legislative career:
For five decades, virtually every major piece of legislation to advance the civil rights, health and economic well being of the American people bore his name and resulted from his efforts.
* Harry Reid:
“As we mourn his loss, we rededicate ourselves to the causes for which he so dutifully dedicated his life.”
A prediction: A lot of people will now ask whether Kennedy’s passing means Reid will “rededicate” himself to getting health care reform through the Senate, and how he intends to do it.
* David Rogers sums up an irony at the heart of Kennedy’s Senate career:
For decades, his liberalism and labor ties made him a butt of ridicule for the right…But over time, that standing allowed Kennedy to be an agent for compromise, an independent actor with a penchant for deal-making that even annoyed his own party leaders. This was true on education, immigration and health issues in the past decade. No other single Democrat could provide such political cover for others when he opted to move to the center.
* A final thought: Kennedy, whose career was rooted in the civil rights era, lived just long enough to pass the torch to Obama in his final speech at the Democratic National Convention:
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Terrible news to wake up to. Rest in peace.
I just don’t see how the Democrats don’t unite and pass a health care reform bill. They HAVE to get it done.
Forget it. This will be a three day story and after that we’re left with one less Senator and a vacancy that could stretch out for months. This could be the final nail in the coffin.
To lose Ted Kennedy is not only to lose a man of formidable political passion and skill, but to lose an important part of the imaginative life of the country. He always said the dream will never die. It’s up to the rest of us now.
I don’t agree Virginia. I think the Senator’s passing will remind at least a few what the fight is really about. Not repubs, as they have dug themselves into a hole from which there is no ladder to climb back up. I think they will just have a few kind words to say and then go about their business of trying to block Obama’s every move and instill fear and hate in the most vulnerable and unbalanced in society. This is of course the complete antithesis of Kennedy’s legacy. There will hopefully be a few dems who will be reminded of the importance of Health CARE Reform and move the process forward in Kennedy’s honor. I lost my father a few years ago, a great and moral man, and I am constantly trying to live up to his ideals, perhaps there will be a few in the Senate who will move the process forward because it is the right thing to do.
Damned sad. I’m old enough to remember John’s assassination. Later, on a beautiful summer day as two friends and I were nailing up political posters along a mountain highway in Brtish Columbia, the news came over the car radio of Bobby’s assassination. Few families have given given as much in serving a nation’s citizens as this one.
LindaS: Absolutely. Several Dems have been pushing, or at least acknowledging, reconciliation in recent days. That’s bound to pick up steam. Schumer, who in may ways is Kennedy’s heir apparent for the mantle of liberal dealmaker, is apparently leading the push.
I also think Kennedy’s passing puts extra pressure on Pres. Obama as the new standard bearer of health care reform. The Senator supported our Pres. and passed the liberal torch to him and I believe Obama will do whatever it takes now to get the best deal we can on reform. He’s heard loud and clear from the progressive base and now needs to get the job done, hopefully with a strong public option. I haven’t given up yet.
I wonder how much commentary on Kennedy from this graceless beast which the conservative movement has become will arrive without a character slur attached?
John McCain got booed a few times yesterday at his town hall, mostly for things he said. Near the end, one nervous older woman stumbled and called him Senator Kennedy. As she caught herself, the crowd booed. She made a little joke saying, I gave you a promotion. McCain chuckled, but the crowd booed louder. McCain said something positive about Kennedy and they settled down but they didn’t like it. It may have been the last gasp of anger, crazy and stupid anyway, now it’s out of bounds.
In 2004 I was so annoyed that Reagan died when he did. It set up a perfect one-week hagiorama in the lull before the conventions. It had to help W, if only by motivating his base. (Of course, they didn’t move on to nobler things, the Swift Boating started soon after).
I hope the Dems are similarly inspired by Teddy’s passing to remember what we stand for and get something good done.
The Pres. is going to comment soon on Kennedy’s passing. Wouldn’t it be a great moment for him to draw a line in the sand for the public option? I know, I’m dreaming and doing a little projecting, but I can’t seem to help myself.
Kathleen, I saw that video of McCain’s town hall and all the booing. He always looks so surprised when someone in the crowd says something ridiculous about the President. I find that so disingenuous since his campaign is where it really all started. He makes and attempt to deny the crowd their sentiments but it is the proverbial snowball for him.
On an side note, a week or two ago someone called me a dickhead for worrying about Kennedy not being able to deliver the 60th vote for cloture.
This was what I was worrying about.
LindaS — you are so right about McCain, and I can’t trust him because of it.
My favorite part was the World War II vet, 87 years old, 60+ years married, on Medicare for 23 years, getting far more than he put into it, and what a great country for it. I’m thinking, okay, this guy is going to be pro-reform. But no. Another me-me-me moment.
These people have no sense of irony.
“This was what I was worrying about”
You and me both. God this leaves a huge hole in the world.
This is a sad day for American politics, not just liberalism. A truely pragmatic and influential figure is gone, and although many will try, none will be able to replace him. One can only hope that someone somewhere will pick up his mantle and continue the quest for the better America that Sen. Kennedy spent his life trying to get to. I sincerely hope they are up to the task, as those shoes are going to be tough to fill.
Well damn. I bet it was breaking his heart he couldn’t see this legislation passed while he was still there to sign it.
This was the last news I saw before going to bed, and it really is a shadow cast over this whole battle for health care reform. However, I think it would help people to remember this isn’t just about politics but about righting the ship of the state and making sure that our future is measured in centuries rather than decades.
Well this is the first thing I saw this morning – it’s an enormous shadow.
When Caroline was being discussed for Clinton’s seat, someone asked me if we were just supposed to hand it to her cause she’s a Kennedy – and I said, well, yes. The Kennedies dedicated their entire lives to this country after Joe made the money. They truly gave the lives of their whole family to the country. It’s an inestimable loss – there’s no way to even gage what we’ve lost. He was the driving liberal force in Congress. I’m just bereft.
There is a very special place in hell for murders such as this jerk.
He should have spent his life in jail, not drinking from the public trough.
It is a happy day – NO MORE KENNEDY in the Senate.
I won’t even pretend to care what you have to say jls, I hope you got your jollies for that.
Paul W. – I suspect that’s just the beginning of the nasty troll comments we’ll see about Ted Kennedy.
Ted Kennedy was never a liberal. He never stood for liberalism. He stood for leftism. There’s absolutely nothing liberal about the left.
I said, well, yes
Okay, but that’s true of other families, too. (If this was the way things worked the Kennedys wouldn’t have ever been in the Senate because we’d still have Massachusetts senators with the last names of Cabot or Lodge.) This isn’t supposed to be a country where one gets a seat at the political table simply because of the fortune of one’s birth. That’s what the House of Lords is all about.
oddjob – It was one among a number of reasons but if someone asks if the Kennedies deserve special respect, I think they do. Name another family that has lost as much while serving – really.
There’s absolutely nothing liberal about the left.
In the eyes of a reactionary authoritarian I can imagine such a statement might seem like truth.
But reactionary authoritarianism is bullshit that sooner or later turns into fascism.
I hope they change the name of the bill to the TMK-3200 so that each time the GOP slurs the bill they’ll be trashing the Ted Moore Kennedy health reform bill. Maybe we can get them down to 15% of the voting population.
Besides, I thought the Senate was our House of Lords.
Isn’t that what all the bitching is about? The talk of getting rid of it?
Just for today could y’all not argue with everything, maybe? I was just posting a thought about the sheer amount of public service the family has engaged in for an entire generation.
To the jls idiot….the real death that we dance to is the death of the GOP! The Republican party is as dead as Ronald Regan and like Ronald Regan THEY’LL STAY DEAD! Your toothless banjo players, teabaggers and ingorant oldsters with their 5th grade education are next in line. Most of them already have one foot in the grave. We see your anger and know it well. It’s the sound of power slipping through your pathetic and impotent lives! Welcome to Hell!
I have wondered if Obama set his original target date for a health bill in the hope of getting it passed before Kennedy died. I hope no one told Sen. Kennedy how badly things are going for his life-long dream.
The year I turned 18, I registered as a Democrat so I could vote against Senator Kennedy in the Democratic primary. Soon after, I changed to an independent and have kept that status since.
I know all the haters will come out with this news; I know that I might have once been amongst them. And I also know that anyone who has any type of openness to truth within them has probably come to an understanding within the last ten years, of Senator Kennedy’s powerful legacy and his determiation to impact this country for the good.
I am grateful for his years of service, for his willingness to take the public heat to continue to serve, and I am saddenad that he will not be able to participate in the continued fight for true health care reform.
To me, his life exemplifies that of a person who fights for redemption. I get that now, I hope others might too.
Damn ya’ll Joe Biden is breaking my heart! Greg ya’ll need to get the video of Biden’s statement. He looked like he would cry at any moment.
Tena, this info. may interest you.
Tena, not only public service but the actual legislative work that has protected the rights of so many. Those with disabilities, funding for aids & HIV, cobra med. insurance, children’s health insurance, and just so many others. If we could just spend one day appreciating everything he and his family have done for this country it would be a welcome respite from the hate and fear that has so consumed the past month. We all know he wasn’t perfect, and made some huge mistakes, but I think most would agree that he was a great American who contributed to the equality and advancement of all of us.
As a student of history, I am near heartbreak over the meanness of destiny. Teddy was never going to be President after the accident, but he still did great work his entire life. No one knows what happened on that bridge the night that woman was killed, but the right hangs their hats on the fact that THEY know, but I’ve never understood what they know that everyone else doesn’t about the accident. Sometimes I don’t understand why we even listen to some of these people anymore. They are so cruel and devious; they talk about Chappaquiddick like they are concerned for the poor dead woman, but we know they aren’t because she was a Robert Kennedy campaign aide, therefore a liberal, therefore a heretic and deserving of her fate!
I can tell that Ted Kennedy was a great man simply because he continued to associate with his fellow Senators whose strongest supporters believed that he was absolute evil, and yet he didn’t harangue these fellows or choke them to death for their stupidity.
Now, we need to work hard to rename health care reform the Edward M. Kennedy Health Reform Act and complete Teddy’s dream of insuring the millions of Americans without health care. The greatest way to honor a great man would be to bring Kennedycare to the masses.
Teena is right; I became a registered Democrat at the age of 18 because even though I grew up in a conservative military family and town, I am not a combat fighter, I am a thinker, and the Kennedy family has exemplified what it means for everyone, rich and poor, tragic and lucky, martially talented or policy inspired, to give their all and their family’s all in service to our nation, to help those less fortunate than us withstand the onslaught of unfettered capitalism and the purchase of our government by corporate interest.
RIP Ted
I hope they don’t turn your memorial into another Wellstone memorial.
You know they will.
RIP Mary Jo Kopechne
I hope they don’t turn your memorial into another Wellstone memorial.
That’s highly unlikely. Kennedy wasn’t up for re-election until next year, for starters. Beyond that, even if he had died unexpectedly while campaigning for re-election the odds of him losing that seat would have been quite low, particularly since Massachusetts has an extremely weak Republican Party.
There would have been no need for the funeral to morph into a political rally.
Nice of you to express sympathy for a fan of Bobby Kennedy, yippie.
In Memory OF Senator Edward Moore Kennedy.
He bent history toward greater social justice, and equal rights for all. One of our greatest humanists has gone from us, into eternity.
THE SONG OF WANDERING AENGUS
I WENT out to the hazel wood,
Because a fire was in my head,
And cut and peeled a hazel wand,
And hooked a berry to a thread;
And when white moths were on the wing,
And moth-like stars were flickering out,
I dropped the berry in a stream
And caught a little silver trout.
When I had laid it on the floor
I went to blow the fire aflame,
But something rustled on the floor,
And some one called me by my name:
It had become a glimmering girl
With apple blossom in her hair
Who called me by my name and ran
And faded through the brightening air.
Though I am old with wandering
Through hollow lads and hilly lands.
I will find out where she has gone,
And kiss her lips and take her hands;
And walk among long dappled grass,
And pluck till time and times are done
The silver apples of the moon,
The golden apples of the sun.
William Butler Yeats.
Fear no more the heat o’ the sun.
Fear no more the heat o’ the sun,
Nor the furious winter’s rages;
Thou thy worldly task hast done,
Home art gone, and ta’en thy wages;
Golden lads and girls all must,
As chimney-sweepers, come to dust.
Fear no more the frown o’ the great;
Thou art past the tyrant’s stroke:
Care no more to clothe and eat;
To thee the reed is as the oak:
The sceptre, learning, physic, must
All follow this, and come to dust.
Fear no more the lightning-flash,
Nor the all-dreaded thunder-stone;
Fear not slander, censure rash;
Thou hast finished joy and moan;
All lovers young, all lovers must
Consign to thee, and come to dust.
No exorciser harm thee!
Nor no witchcraft charm thee!
Ghost unlaid forbear thee!
Nothing ill come near thee!
Quiet consummation have;
And renownéd be thy grave!
– William Shakespeare
Here’s the video of Biden Remembering Ted Kennedy
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0809/Biden_remembers.html?showall
Watch it, and try not to feel his pain.
Wasting huge amounts of taxpayer money on Obamacare would be a fitting tribute to Ted Kennedy, I agree with that. But Ted Kennedy was only popular with “the left of the left”. Outside of Massachusetts and Moveon mailing lists he is poison.
All, here’s some video of Ted Kennedy fighting for health care reform — way back in 1971:
http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/health-care/video-ted-kennedy-fighting-for-national-health-insurance-nearly-three-decades-ago/
thanks Liam and lamh31- Fitting tributes all.
oddjob | August 26th, 2009 at 11:11 am
Nice of you to express sympathy for a fan of Bobby Kennedy, yippie.
–
well I’m sure most on here could give a poot about the life of this woman that was taken at the hands of Teddy and covered up and excused by the DNC and the state of MA.
fan of Bobby and murdered by Teddy.
I do however give my sympathy to his loved ones but I have no sympathy for a man that left a woman to die so he could save his political career. That is a core function of who he was not the bs that is being spewed all over the media and the morally bankrupt DNC.
I will leave you all to morn your hero.
Hey oddjob – that link rocks. Thanks – it does interest me. Look, it took me awhile to appreciate everything the Kennedy family really has done for the country. I had to climb over a lot of anti-Kennedy feeling from my fellow Texans to get to where I had a clear view of the family and what they did for us. Because they really fought for us.
I wonder if the tradition of wealthy families like the Roosevelts and the Kennedies, who bucked their class to go to war for the common good still exists at all in this country.
The cynics who do nothing but complain about ‘government bureaucrats’, blah, blah, blat are nothing a bunch of jerks.
I hope every adult in this country points their kids to Senator Kennedy as one of the most positive examples we have of one man’s commitment to the public good.
That is a core function of who he was not the bs that is being spewed all over the media and the morally bankrupt DNC.
I will leave you all to morn your hero.
Ummmmm, no.
Frankly in my own mind that he was capable of leaving the scene of an accident (something where the circumstances were such that nearly all of the rest of us would most likely have been charged with a felony), does not preclude the good he also did.
He is unavoidably the most historically significant and influential senator to come from Massachusetts since Daniel Webster.
@Tena,
The key difference about the Kennedy’s was that they were not old money. Their father was the first generation to become wealthy, but he was born into a working class Boston Irish family, as was Rose Fitzgerald. They were not removed from the travails and struggles of the “shanty Irish”, as the blue bloods, old money, would often refer to newly arrived Irish Catholics.
From the start, when JFK, first got into politics, and his brothers worked on his campaigns, they were immersed in the every day lives of the poor working class neighborhoods of Boston.
I think that we will see other families emerge, like the Kennedys did. There is no reason why some Hispanic family, or some other ethnic family can not emerge in the same upwardly mobile manner that the Kennedys did.
I though that Christians were taught to hate the sin, but love the sinner!
Folks,
On this day, I urge you to stop dialogging with the hate mongers, that do not have the common decency to restrain their selves, and let the family mourn their loss.
When you dialog with those cretins, all you are doing is giving them more chances to respond, and repeat their diatribes.
Please just ignore them. Their behavior show that they did not hate the man’s sins,but instead they hated his great accomplishments.
he was born into a working class Boston Irish family, as was Rose Fitzgerald
Those assertions aren’t quite accurate. Rose’s father John was born into a working class family, and the family drew its political strength from Boston’s Irish working class, but by the time Rose was born her father was already politically connected. John Fitzgerald was elected to the Massachusetts Senate when she was just one or two years old. Later he became the first Irish-American mayor of Boston.
Likewise Joe’s father was born to working class Irish immigrants, but by the time Joe was born his father was already the successful owner of several businesses (largely either bars or businesses associated with that, such as importing whiskey) and a state legislator.
There is no reason why some Hispanic family, or some other ethnic family can not emerge in the same upwardly mobile manner that the Kennedys did.
That won’t surprise me if it happens.
oddjob
“Frankly in my own mind that he was capable of leaving the scene of an accident (something where the circumstances were such that nearly all of the rest of us would most likely have been charged with a felony), does not preclude the good he also did.”
I agree oddjob…its important to look past these “incidents” and look at the greater good. Just like we do with Bill Ayers…he’s been great for indoctri…reforming our education system.
Being politically connected is not the same as being from old wealth. Lots of working class Irish, were politically connected in those days.
The Irish political machines were working class organizations. Mr. Curley, for example, or Tom Prendergast’s machine, which gave Harry Truman his start.
Mayor Daley of Chicago was not from a well off family , but boy, was he politically connected.
liam
Just so you know, 13 of the top 100 top searches on google has something to do with Kennedy and his “incident”. to me this suggests that not many people know about or knew about this “incident” and they’re using it to form their opinion now that they are presented with more historical information on his history.
http://www.google.com/trends/hottrends
Here’s today’s Boston Globe account.
Being politically connected is not the same as being from old wealth. Lots of working class Irish, were politically connected in those days.
That’s true, and they weren’t from old wealth, but by the time Rose & Joe were born they weren’t working class anymore, either, even as they drew their political clout (and identity, and political agendas) from the working class (especially the Irish Roman Catholic working class).
In that way they were very different from the Roosevelts, who had come from old money, but were often atypically concerned with those less well-off than they themselves.
“I want it at UMass. UMass people are my people.”
- Ted Kennedy, referring to his wish that the newly established Edward M. Kennedy Institute for the United States Senate be located on the UMass-Boston campus
Yet another example of the Kennedy’s working-class identity.
WilliamC
“Before it’s all over, it’ll be called the Ted Kennedy Memorial Healthcare bill,” Limbaugh said on his show.(Mar 6, 2009)
The Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee quickly launched a petition drive urging Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele to denounce Limbaugh. The committee’s executive director, Brian Wolff, called the remark “reprehensible” and “truly outrageous.”
Please note the countless Dems, DNC and majority of the Plum Line posters who are now for this or are you still against this and want the DNC to now expand their protest to Byrd, Feinstein and other?….HAHAHAHA. You agree with Limbaugh!
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2009/03/limbaugh_health.html
(Kennedys’)
You can always sort out the frauds by their own words.
They claim to be appalled b that Senator Kennedy was not prosecuted in a harsh manner, but then they turn around and lavish praise on a guy, who far more recently, was purchasing, and ingesting massive amounts of illegal drugs, and paying drug lords for them, over and over. The same guy, then got caught using a false prescription for Viagra. All that happened very recently, to the guy that they worship, and they have no problem with him getting a pass.
They are not for the rule of law. They are for the rule of law being used against their political foes.
Can you say “T*rd Blossom” Federal Prosecutor show trials, boys and girls?
liam,
Who cares…he didn’t kill anyone and was only harming himself….the best part is that you and limbaugh agree on the title of the healthcare reform….sounds like you’re a now a ditto head(sp)?
Who cares…he didn’t kill anyone and was only harming himself
Worth noting for the next time you decry hypocrisy.
Oh, and insofar as he was paying drug lords for the drugs for his addiction? Your assertion isn’t even true.
hypocrisy is being apalled at his comments in March and now support them in August….stop straying from the point.
The only good Kennedy was Joe the son who was killed when his plane exploded during WWII (or as you commenters here know it, “The Great Patriotic War of the Soviet People”).
The story of how Senator Ted. Kennedy rescued a Jewish family from Russia, and saved their little girl’s life.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/08/26/littlest.refusenik.kennedy/index.html
Hypocrisy is also being appalled by the wrongdoing of your political opponents, but not the wrongdoing of your own.
You would know oddjob I’m sure. I am such a hypocrite, I mean what was that GOP guy’s name who called his lawyer while his date drowned, trapped in a car that he drove off a bridge while drunk? What was his name again. I must be getting old.
Or do you mean “crimes” like disintegrating Taliban leaders and their families in Pakistan?
Wow – Do some people not get the difference between naming a bill after someone, after his death, or saying it would be named after someone in anticipation of his death. Keep talking Republicans, you are just cementing independents determination to stay far far away from your party.
I don’t care what Rush Limbaugh ever says. I see no reason to let him get us upset. In fact; if it was up to me, I would have run with what he said, and named the Bill after Senator Kennedy, as soon as Rush mentioned the idea, and also issued a press release thanking Rush Limbaugh for his great suggestion. That would have taken the wind out of his world wide pants.
It digusts me that they used every means necessary to keep this 77 year old alive for six to eight months after his use to society was gone. The healthcare money they used on him could have been used to help a younger more productive member of society.
lol!
# liam | August 26th, 2009 at 02:51 pm
You can always sort out the frauds by their own words.
They claim to be appalled b that Senator Kennedy was not prosecuted in a harsh manner, but then they turn around and lavish praise on a guy, who far more recently, was purchasing, and ingesting massive amounts of illegal drugs, and paying drug lords for them, over and over. The same guy, then got caught using a false prescription for Viagra. All that happened very recently, to the guy that they worship, and they have no problem with him getting a pass.
They are not for the rule of law. They are for the rule of law being used against their political foes.
Can you say “T*rd Blossom” Federal Prosecutor show trials, boys and girls?
—
HUH??? You equate leaving a young women at the bottom of the river to DIE to someone addicted to oxycodone who has never physically harmed another person?
geesh this is the most desperate attempt I have seen to deflect from the fact that a young woman was murdered by a politician who left her dead at the bottom of that river for 10 hours then lied and got away with murder.
folks like you are scary and how on earth did you get so brainwashed?
OMG this is funnier then Teddy changing the law in MA when he thought Kerry would win then it turning around to bite the DNC in the rump and requesting the law be changed back! How honorable what character although it also fits the definition of tyranny and Hugo baby operates his country that way!
—–
# Dike Bridge | August 26th, 2009 at 02:28 pm
WilliamC
“Before it’s all over, it’ll be called the Ted Kennedy Memorial Healthcare bill,” Limbaugh said on his show.(Mar 6, 2009)
The Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee quickly launched a petition drive urging Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele to denounce Limbaugh. The committee’s executive director, Brian Wolff, called the remark “reprehensible” and “truly outrageous.”
Please note the countless Dems, DNC and majority of the Plum Line posters who are now for this or are you still against this and want the DNC to now expand their protest to Byrd, Feinstein and other?….HAHAHAHA. You agree with Limbaugh!
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2009/03/limbaugh_health.html
Kennedy’s death recalls the death of President Nixon. His enemys loved to kick him around, but their problem was that they couldn’t always connect with Tricky Dick’s backside.
Teddy’s enemies never had that problem. To paraphrase Michael Kinsley, We really don’t have Teddy to kick around anymore.
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