Obama: Fort Hood Shooter Will Meet Justice “In This World — And The Next”
In his remarks at the Fort Hood memorial, Obama manages a delicate balancing act: Acknowledging the religious dimensions of the shooting, and claiming that no just God would have condoned the shooter’s religious motives, while also making it clear that Muslims still have a place in our armed forces.
From the prepared remarks:
It may be hard to comprehend the twisted logic that led to this tragedy. But this much we do know -– no faith justifies these murderous and craven acts; no just and loving God looks upon them with favor. And for what he has done, we know that the killer will be met with justice –- in this world, and the next.
And this, on our armed forces, who are “white, black, and brown,” and “of all faiths”:
They have stood watch in blinding deserts and on snowy mountains. They have extended the opportunity of self-government to peoples that have suffered tyranny and war. They are man and woman; white, black, and brown; of all faiths and stations –- all Americans, serving together to protect our people, while giving others half a world away the chance to lead a better life.
Full remarks here.
This blog’s homepage is here. RSS feed here. Twitter feed here. Email me here.
“They have extended the opportunity of self-government to peoples that have suffered tyranny and war.”
Hurrah for that!
He is a master at the balancing act.
You know what I keep thinking of, Greg? When Colin Powell endorsed Obama and said it was based in part of the picture of the grieving mother wrapped around her son’s headstone. And it had a crescent moon on it = he was a Muslim.
George W. Bush sure got us in a hell of a mess –
Through October, 10 Fort Hood soldiers had taken their lives in 2009, the second-highest tally in the Army behind Kentucky’s Fort Campbell, which had 16 suicides.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125747341095832795.html
I particularly like his statement that we don’t have to look to the past to find a “greatest generation” because of the sacrifices this generation of soldiers (and families) are making with two wars, multiple tours, etc….
Great point, Tena. Thanks for that. I’d forgotten that image.
OT but related in so many ways. From Blue Texan.
And the Fort Hood tragedy is only getting worse from the right, so sad they politicize everything.
“As an underdog U.S. Senate candidate courting the GOP’s conservative wing, Marco Rubio takes a hard-line position against illegal immigration: no amnesty. [...] The son of Cuban exiles born in Miami says he opposed the proposal spearheaded in 2006 by former Sen. Mel Martinez — whose early retirement triggered Rubio’s 2010 campaign — that would have allowed illegal immigrants to work toward citizenship. Crist supported the bill.
Indeed, Rubio recently smacked Crist for that position on the stump.
“He supported cap and trade,” Rubio said of Crist. “He supported the stimulus package. He supported amnesty for illegal aliens. These are all major issues that are going to be coming up in Washington.
So how did Rubio’s parents, who fled Castro’s Cuba in 1959, get in? Yep, they were granted amnesty.
Shortly after Castro won control, some elite Cubans fled to Miami. As the flow grew, Presidents Eisenhower, John F. Kennedy, and Lyndon Johnson used the parole power to admit them. From 1959 to the Cuban missile crisis of 1962, more than 200,000 arrived.”
“multiple tours, etc….”
I really hate this all-volunteer army, I’ll be honest with you. The government has no problem sending both parents of small children into combat. WE never used to be in the business of making orphans.
But the main point is that the Bush Administration pushed our military to the breaking point long long before Obama ever took the oath of office.
I wish we could stop and just bring them home.
“So how did Rubio’s parents, who fled Castro’s Cuba in 1959, get in? Yep, they were granted amnesty”
Well duh – he’s a Republican, right? If you look up hypocrite in the dictionary I swear it says: Republican.
Tena or Greg, can you post a link to that photo? This might be the time the country really needs to see that. When we get into the details of events and policies, we sometimes forget how powerful pictures can be.
I wonder if anyone at Fox was paying attention to Obama’s words.
“We are a nation of laws whose commitment to justice is so enduring that we would treat a gunman and give him due process, just as surely as we will see that he pays for his crimes.
We are a nation that guarantees the freedom to worship as one chooses. And instead of claiming God for our side, we remember Lincoln’s words, and always pray to be on the side of God.”
The speech seems striking to me in that it makes the point very clear that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are wars that are waged to both secure our own freedom and security here at home, as well as the security of our allies, but to also extend freedom and security to those who suffer under tyranny.
It was not an actual photo I believe, it was a story described by Colin Powell when he endorsed Obama in 2008 (an endorsement that helped moved my Republican mom into the Obama camp). Obama is the master of projecting strength while expressing empathy to both sides of a conflict. I hope he succeeds legislatively as well, our country continues to need leadership of this fashion.
“Tena or Greg, can you post a link to that photo?”
I don’t have the link, but I can look for it.
“It was not an actual photo I believe,”
I saw the photo.
SBJ, get that batsh*it crazy justification for Iraq out of here. We didn’t not go abroad to Iraq to defend liberty at home, that is absurd on its face and doesn’t even need to be a part of the discussion on this post. Try and honor the fallen members of our armed services without pushing your own agenda. Just for veterans day can we do that?
But the main point is that the Bush Administration pushed our military to the breaking point long long before Obama ever took the oath of office.
Until he showed up it was not (at least since 1960) typical that the National Guard routinely served foreign tours of duty in combat zones.
Here ya go:
http://www.laprogressive.com/2008/10/21/why-the-nations-most-respected-general-supports-barack-obama/
*did NOT go to Iraq to defend… Typo.
“Obama is the master of projecting strength while expressing empathy to both sides of a conflict.”
That may be true but what are the two sides of this “conflict?” The man is a traitor, plain and simple.
We went to Iraq because a bunch of imperialists in the Bush White House moved in with the specific desire to add Iraq to our de facto empire.
@Paul W: “SBJ, get that batsh*it crazy justification for Iraq out of here. We didn’t not go abroad to Iraq to defend liberty at home, that is absurd on its face and doesn’t even need to be a part of the discussion on this post. Try and honor the fallen members of our armed services without pushing your own agenda. Just for veterans day can we do that?”
Oh my! Tomorrow is Veteran’s day and you should read Obama’s prepared text:
“In Afghanistan and Pakistan, the same extremists who killed nearly 3,000 Americans continue to endanger America, our allies, and innocent Afghans and Pakistanis. In Iraq, we are working to bring a war to a successful end, as there are still those who would deny the Iraqi people the future that Americans and Iraqis have sacrificed so much for.”
…
“In today’s wars, there is not always a simple ceremony that signals our troops’ success – no surrender papers to be signed, or capital to be claimed. But the measure of their impact is no less great – in a world of threats that no know borders, it will be marked in the safety of our cities and towns, and the security and opportunity that is extended abroad. And it will serve as testimony to the character of those who serve.”
…
“Long after they are laid to rest – when the fighting has finished, and our nation has endured; when today’s servicemen and women are veterans, and their children have grown – it will be said of this generation that they believed under the most trying of tests; that they persevered not just when it was easy, but when it was hard; and that they paid the price and bore the burden to secure this nation, and stood up for the values that live in the hearts of all free peoples.”
Thanks, Tena, I had thought I remembered that photo, too. And, while we’re at it, could somebody send it to Justice Scalia who evidently doesn’t believe in anything other than a cross marking a burial/memorial site???
We OBVIOUSLY went to Iraq for oil and profiteering.
Former Bush officials ‘are leading a new business push into Iraq.’
…the Financial Times reports today that even more Bush administration officials are eyeing profits in Iraq:
Senior Bush administration figures including Zalmay Khalilzad, former US ambassador to Baghdad, and Jay Garner, the retired general who led reconstruction efforts immediately after the war, are leading a new business push into Iraq.
The two one-time senior officials are among a raft of former US soldiers and diplomats either leveraging their war experience helping foreign companies to enter the Iraqi market or starting businesses there themselves.
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/11/10/bush-officials-iraq-business/
Oddjob – word up. The day Gore conceded, I turned to Mr. Tena and said: I hope you know we’re invading Iraq.
It was only about as plain as the nose on your face to anyone who had paid any attention to Commander Coocoo and his family.
Seriously- the family is in the armaments business through Poppy. And Cheney’s stock in Haliburton went from a value of just over $200,000 to just over $9 billion in one year. The first year of the Iraq War.
Greg -heard anything else on that investigation into Bush Administration DOD propaganda?
After reading his speech today I am so glad to be on the side that chose hope over fear. As things have progressed so far this year the right is mongering fear even more than I expected and I feel sad for them.
No one in recent history has inspired so much hope in the country and the world as our president, and even though I don’t always agree with every decision or policy, I am simply grateful for the optimism.
Thank you for the photo Tena, I remember it well and it would be good advice for those on the right determined to demonize the Muslim faith to remember it as well. Our country and our military has always been and will always be a “melting pot”.
sbj isn’t just trollus pilisplitticus,, he’s also trollus serpentinthegrassus:
It is characterized thusly:
Dude just lays around waiting for you to say something, says O Really? Then you disagree with {insert name of Democrat currently in favor here} and that makes you a hypocrite.
“After reading his speech today I am so glad to be on the side that chose hope over fear. ”
Co=sign that all over the place.
It was only about as plain as the nose on your face
If GWB had clearly indicated he was going to more or less follow the policies of his father I don’t think it would have been so clear (despite the family involvement with oil & arms), but when he brought Rumsfeld on board and all those other neoconservatives there was no other conclusion:
January 26, 1998
The Honorable William J. Clinton
President of the United States
Washington, DC
Dear Mr. President:
…
We urge you to articulate this aim, and to turn your Administration’s attention to implementing a strategy for removing Saddam’s regime from power. This will require a full complement of diplomatic, political and military efforts. Although we are fully aware of the dangers and difficulties in implementing this policy, we believe the dangers of failing to do so are far greater. We believe the U.S. has the authority under existing UN resolutions to take the necessary steps, including military steps, to protect our vital interests in the Gulf. In any case, American policy cannot continue to be crippled by a misguided insistence on unanimity in the UN Security Council….
Sincerely,
Elliott Abrams Richard L. Armitage William J. Bennett
Jeffrey Bergner John Bolton Paula Dobriansky
Francis Fukuyama Robert Kagan Zalmay Khalilzad
William Kristol Richard Perle Peter W. Rodman
Donald Rumsfeld William Schneider, Jr. Vin Weber
Paul Wolfowitz R. James Woolsey Robert B. Zoellick
Tena,
Here’s part of the Jabar interview from CNN.
CHETRY: I’m sure you’ve been paying attention to the ongoing debate about health care. Have you taken a stand on that? Do you have an opinion on what we need to do as a nation to ensure more people can have access to health care?
ABDUL-JABBAR: I’m all for that. We have the best technology in the world. We’re supposed to be the ‘can-do’ nation. And our health care system really fails so many people. Especially poor people, people who don’t have the means to go to private doctors. I think we should change that. I think it’s absolutely crucial. Certainly it’s a just and noble cause to make health care available to everyone.
“That may be true but what are the two sides of this “conflict?” The man is a traitor, plain and simple.”
Your mother is a traitor, you phuucking petri dish.
“Certainly it’s a just and noble cause to make health care available to everyone.”
Yes it is. The only thing worse than having myeloid leukemia would be having it and not having the money for treatment.
I wish Jabar well. It can be controlled with medication if it’s caught early like that, I think. My dad was already really sick when he was diagnosed.
“sbj isn’t just trollus pilisplitticus,, he’s also trollus serpentinthegrassus.”
I am quite sincerely trying to draw attention to portions of his speech. It seems to me that Obama is here laying the groundwork for an escalation on the basis of our security here at home, our duty to provide security for our allies, and our “moral duty” to bring security and opportunity to those abroad. I’m not looking for a gotcha moment here (although with you it’s like shooting sitting ducks), I honestly think that there’s quite a bit going on in that speech that applies to some of the decisions Obama will soon face.
Two sides to the conflict? Two sides deserving empathy? We need a national leader who will be empathetic to the crazed killers who want to behead and burn us?
You have got to be kidding.
And blaming Bush??? You people are sick, sick, sick.
We have an army COS who says losing our “diversity” — Muslim terrorists in our own military? — would be worse than these murders. Undoubtedly that was the message from the WH. Utterly crazy sentiments.
sbj
I heard Gibbs said on AF One today that he has it narrowed down to four options. We’ll find out soon, I’m sure. And remember he was speaking in front of a group of men, women and children who have sacrificed so much. Let’s give them props for accomplishing so much given the circumstances. I don’t think he was necessarily signaling his thoughts going forward but commending their hard work and accomplishments.
“Said General Powell, I’m also troubled by, not what Senator McCain says, but what members of the party say. And it is permitted to be said such things as, ‘Well, you know that Mr. Obama is a Muslim.’ Well, the correct answer is, he is not a Muslim, he’s a Christian. He’s always been a Christian. But the really right answer is, what if he is? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer’s no, that’s not America.””
That’s not America, said Colin Powell. Who is, I take it, sick sick sick.
Secretary Clinton told Charlie Rose that we are in Afghanistan for the purpose of protecting our own national security. She went on to say, that it would be nice if schools and education were improved for the Afghanistan people, but that is up to them, and not us, because all we are concerned with is our own national security. So much for the SBJ nonsense about we going into countries to liberate them. Let us know when we do that for the women of Saudi Arabia, or all the people of Burma, etc….
I find it more than ironic that SBJ is so captivated with the fairy tale about we are just invading countries to liberate their people, especially since he would not be accepted in our so called: “liberation army” because of his sexual orientation.
Obama: “In Iraq, we are working to bring a war to a successful end, as there are still those who would deny the Iraqi people the future that Americans and Iraqis have sacrificed so much for.”
…
“In today’s wars, there is not always a simple ceremony that signals our troops’ success…it will be marked in the safety of our cities and towns, and the security and opportunity that is extended abroad.”
“because of his sexual orientation.”
which I truly believe is as big a fairy tale he made up to get your goat, Liam.
I don’t believe he’s gay for one second. I very instantly produced an African American partner one day just because we were discussing something and he could use it – he said something like: “that’s going to be interesting to my AA partner.”
I don’t believe a word he says, Liam, and it’s up to you whether you do or not, of course. I’m just sayin.
What. We went in to Iraq just to liberate them; Really?
What ever happened to the WMD bullshite reason!
I remember that he instantly produced an AA partner =
when I get new keyboard, I’m going to take a hammer to this one
Tena,
It does not matter if he is telling the truth or not. It is his story, so he is stuck with it. It now paints him in the absurd position of bragging about how our armed forces are going around the world to liberate people, while they are engaging in the oppression of people here at home, because of their sexual orientation.
“After reading his speech today I am so glad to be on the side that chose hope over fear.”
You didn’t chose hope over fear.
You chose feel-good naivete over reality.
You chose illusory promises of utopia over liberty.
You chose chameleonesque celebrity over substance.
And you chose appeasement over strength.
Republican/Libertarian/Right Wingers are an evolutionary dead-end. It’s not about ideology or politics. I think they are the end result of a genetic mutation somewhere along the line that turned off a handful of genes that control: empathy, logic, fear, self-perception, and an assortment of other emotions that one needs to deal with in order to live in a modern society. They just don’t have the mental capacity to live like normal people. It is a genetic defect. It’s not their fault.
“It does not matter if he is telling the truth or not”
Of course that’s true, my dear; as is your assessment of his situation.
You chose feel-good naivete over reality.
And you choose cowardice over all.
Someday you’ll understand that.
The sick one has long, long been you.
In 1776 you would have wholly sided with the British, and then fled to what became Canada.
You do not belong here.
“empathy, logic, fear, self-perception, and an assortment of other emotions that one needs to deal with in order to live in a modern society. They just don’t have the mental capacity to live like normal people. It is a genetic defect. It’s not their fault.”
Um, the latest thinking is that the entire reason we walk upright is a kind of empathy and a kind of logic no other hominid got, apparently. The males in Ardi’s species, our missing link, or very close to it, started walking upright so they could travel out to food and carry it back to females and they could win the genetic Hominid Idol by giving us presents rather than fighting with great big males for us. There are other factors involved, mainly that female humans are the only hominid and I think the only species in which even the female doesn’t know when she’s fertile , so wooing went on all the time – not just whenever a female was in season. Males quit fighting over a female in season and began trying to form pair bonds with females that lasted over time.
Empathy made us.
Letting Bin Laden go scott free out of Tora Bora is real appeasement, and then taking off for Iraq, instead of finishing the job in Afghanistan is real appeasement.
Paying off the Sunni Rebels in Saddam’s home region is appeasement.
Getting hundreds of marines blown to smithereens in Beirut, and then pulling out of there is appeasement. Trading arms for hostages, with the sponsors of the Beirut bombing, and the taking of those hostages, is the ultimate in appeasement.
Republicans are the experts when it comes to appeasement.
They are the ones who fled from the roof tops in Vietnam, and it was a Republican President who settled for a stalemate in Korea.
Republicans talk tough, but they are nothing but a bunch of historical losers, led by a bunch of chicken hawk draft dodgers.
“You do not belong here.”
Your radical 20th century ideology is a contradiction of all the principles on which America was founded. You are an alien presence, indeed a disease within the polity. It’s downright obscene for you to claim any philosophical heritage here.
# Tena | November 10th, 2009 at 04:04 pm
“It does not matter if he is telling the truth or not”
Of course that’s true, my dear; as is your assessment of his situation.
……………..
What the hell is that supposed to mean?
“Empathy made us.”
And a mutation took that away. It’s just a theory. But we are obviously still evolving as a species and I believe that has something to do with the way the “Right” shows a distinct pattern of lies and failed logic that is not the norm in developed society.
That you’re right, Liam? That’s all I meant.
Ha ha! You confused liam, tena!
It’s rather pathetic of you two to stoop to calling me a liar just because I don’t hold views “typical” of gay people or of those in an interracial relationship.
It’s a theory, but they spent 22 years on it before they released the entire data on Ardi.
I’m so in love with the whole Ardi discovery I can’t stand it! LOL
“r just because I don’t hold views “typical” of gay people or of those in an interracial relationship.”
It’s not that – LOL! – it’s because I don’t believe a word you say.
“They are the ones who fled from the roof tops in Vietnam, and it was a Republican President who settled for a stalemate in Korea.”
Do you contend we should have stuck it out and esclated in Vietnam? Do you contend we should have crossed the Yalu and fought China for North Korea?
Letting Bin Laden go scott free out of Tora Bora is real appeasement, and then taking off for Iraq, instead of finishing the job in Afghanistan is real appeasement.”
That’s nothing but a bogus liberal fairy tale. So is the rest of your blather.
How is Obama’s appeasement of Iran working out? His appeasement of Russian and selling out Eastern Europe? Why hasn’t the Muslim radical world swooned before the One as you all boldly predicted? Why are they still trying to kill us, just like always?
Hope and change, really changing things.
“
Some comments from Politico:
Must have been difficult for Hussein Blobama to stand with patriotic people. He’s a Muslim Low Life, just like that Murderer at Fort Hood.
Obama is a muslim and is doing to our country what that nut case did to Ft. Hood. Simple.
yeah, let pretend his religion wasn’t the reason he tried to kill everyone. thats realistic. Almost as realistic as socialized healthcare bringing down costs.
Michelle Obama is an UGLY FAT A$$ PIG. Just ask the drug dealers.
Did he apologize for what a crappy country America is while he was there?
—————————-
These people are not normal. It could be psychological, but I don’t think so. I think it is biological, and thus genetic.
You’re a real card, Ethan.
How do you explain all the deranged lies that are routinely told on this blog, Dkos and others by lefties like you?
Like all the ones I and Scott and sbj have exposed right here?
QB, at times I really feel sorry for you.
Now you are the one who is lying. I never said that you were lying about your sexual orientation, and I have no way of knowing if you are telling the truth or not.
I tend to believe that you are, because you went to great lengths, a few days of ago, to try and persuade Quarterback to become more understanding of you and your partner. Of course he rebuffed you. Like I have told you in the past, you are a glutton for punishment, because you keep seeking approval from right wingers who hate your guts, and consider you to be sub-human.
Liam never said he doubted you, sbj.
I’m the one who finally told Liam that. Your homosexuality popped up one day months ago when it was a very convenient time in the discussion.
Rather like your partner’s reputed ethnicity.
Don’t jump Liam because I don’t believe you. He always has, at least it seemed so.
Democrats win wars. Republicans either lose them, run away, or Appease.
FDR defeated two massive empires, simultaneously. in have the time it took the Faux Rancher from Texas to make a dog’s vomit out of his Iraq Lunancy.
The can not handle the truth. Here is the historical reality.
Letting Bin Laden go scott free out of Tora Bora is real appeasement, and then taking off for Iraq, instead of finishing the job in Afghanistan is real appeasement.
Paying off the Sunni Rebels in Saddam’s home region is appeasement.
Getting hundreds of marines blown to smithereens in Beirut, and then pulling out of there is appeasement. Trading arms for hostages, with the sponsors of the Beirut bombing, and the taking of those hostages, is the ultimate in appeasement.
Republicans are the experts when it comes to appeasement.
They are the ones who fled from the roof tops in Vietnam, and it was a Republican President who settled for a stalemate in Korea.
Republicans talk tough, but they are nothing but a bunch of historical losers, led by a bunch of chicken hawk draft dodgers.
Ethan,
You needn’t. I am well adjusted, clear thinking, rational, and attendant to truth. You aren’t any of those things. But I don’t feel sorry for you. You’ve chosen your path.
edit;
in half the time….
@Liam: You make more sense than tena! I am going to give you props for your last post – hurrah. I apologize for having written that you called me a liar.
I believe that the only way we are going to get rid of homophobia is for all gay people to come out of the closet so that everyone can see for themselves that they already love and respect someone who is gay. I believe in a a general approach that does not deny rights to any group and does not grant special rights to any group. In that specific regard (legislation) I believe the Republican approach may be better than the Democratic approach. We will never be able to legislate respect. I do not seek QB’s approval, or Republican approval, or your approval.
re; sbj’s “Obama’s a traitor plain and simple”-
You know, he must have one of the biggest cranial-podiatral problems I’ve seen. Perhaps some health care reform will do him good.
“Don’t jump Liam because I don’t believe you.”
I apologized, tena. Now pardon me while I go play the grand piano in my Taos vacation home while doing pro bono legal work for innocent minorities right after I donate all my spare time and money to noble liberal causes.
“re; sbj’s “Obama’s a traitor plain and simple”-”
????????????
Are you nuts? I was writing about the Ft Hood killer!
Brilliant, Liam, you just repeated the same blather verbatim.
Except that you added your usual bragging about FDR winning WWII single handedly. In case you hadn’t noticed, that was a long time before the modern Dem party turned against America in the 1960s and 70s.
FDR, morever, “won” WWII with quite a bit of help, you might recall, including not only an entire world mobilized against aggression but “chickenhawk Republicans” like Eisenhower and MacArthur contributing in their own “minor” way. That same war in which noted “chickenhawk Republicans” George HW Bush and Bob Dole, later to be ridiculed by the one and only Draft Dodger President, WJ Clinton.
You left out some things, too, like the Gulf War. And you think we lost Korea because we didn’t invade the north. And you didn’t explain why Kennedy and Johnson utterly failed and screwed up Vietnam. Turning that war over to McNamara was brilliant, wasn’t? And then the quitters like Humphrey and Bobby Kennedy took over the party.
You’re a vapid old partisan demogogue and nothing more. Your ideas are a cancer on our country.
You want to talk about appeasement. Which President was it that went to China, and kissed Mao’s arse? Gee, who was it that did that. O yeah, now I remember; It was Republican President, Richard M. Nixon.
If bluster, lies, and bullshite were all it took to win wars, then Republicans would conquer the world.
“These people are not normal. It could be psychological, but I don’t think so. I think it is biological, and thus genetic.”
Ethan, they are more like cowards.
““re; sbj’s “Obama’s a traitor plain and simple”-”
????????????
Are you nuts? I was writing about the Ft Hood killer!”
Democrats are used to calling Republicans traitors — like Algore calling Bush a traitor and Obama cronies Moveon calling Petreaus a traitor.
They just imagine it goes both ways.
“I am well adjusted, clear thinking, rational, and attendant to truth”
That’s just so obviously false.
From now on I expect all of your posts to be “clear thinking, rational, and attendant to the truth.”
That means you will need to provide information or data to back up all of your claims. All of them. And any opinions not grounded in factual information are to be recognized as such.
Let’s see if you are what you say you are. I doubt you can last 24 hours without going back on that assertion.
Reagan was the one who sent Rumsfeld to kiss up to Saddam, and then send him his WMD starter kits.
Bush One, let him stay in power, and stood by as he gassed the Kurds, and the Shiites, after Bush had urged them to rebel. He let Saddam turn Chemical Ali loose on them.
Republicans have a long sordid history of appeasement, and propping up evil dictators.
“Obama cronies Moveon calling Petreaus a traitor.”
Jeez. You didn’t even wait for me to post my post before you made a fool of yourself.
The clock starts NOW. Can you do it? Can you be “clear thinking, rational, and attendant to the truth.” I doubt it.
Is he going to smoke ‘em out?
No need to “smoke ‘em out”. Didn’t you see him in his warrior garb, when he stood before his Mission Accomplished sign?, and that is why all the Troops have been back from Iraq, for at least the past five years.
Ethan, you are laughable. Let’s see all of your posts do this:
“That means you will need to provide information or data to back up all of your claims. All of them. And any opinions not grounded in factual information are to be recognized as such.”
ROTFLMAO
Or Tena’s, or Liam’s, or any of the other liberal clown posse members. I’ve shown all of them to be full of bs and spouting lies and misinformation. And you are as bad as they come.
So from now on you’ll need to post factual support for all claims you make. Otherwise they are presumptively lies and misinformation.
That’s your standard, not mine, so let’s see you do it.
Republicans have a long history of appeasement, and cowardice, and Quarterbrain just can not handle the truth.
Eisenhower ordered the CIA to overthrow the elected government of Iran, and he then installed the Shah.
The Republicans have always sided with tyrants, while proclaiming how much the want to liberate other nations.
“That’s your standard, not mine, so let’s see you do it.”
EXACTLY. That IS my standard and NOT yours. THAT IS THE POINT.
Are you willing to try for 24 hours? I will. Any posts I make will have either factual data from a non-partisan source or I will note that it is my opinion.
Will you put in an attempt? 24 hours. Whaddya say? Deal?
qb, and you chose paranoia, cynicism and fear, congratulations.
Paranoia and fear that radical Islamists really do want to kill the infidels and follow an ideology that tells them it is their destiny and duty to subjugate us?
Congratulations on equating recognition of reality with paranoia.
@ethan: “Or I will note that it is my opinion.”
Might as well just hang a big banner on it saying “DO NOT READ”
So, QB, are you willing to try for 24 hours?
What about you SBJ?
Willing to post only assertions backed by non-partisan facts or note that it is just your opinion?
Can you do it for 24 hours?
Tena, thanks for posting the link to that photo. Since it’s way up the thread, she posted the photo Colin Powell was referring to when he talked about a mother at the grave of her soldier son, and the marker has a Muslim crescent moon on it.http://www.laprogressive.com/2008/10/21/why-the-nations-most-respected-general-supports-barack-obama/
“or I will note that it is my opinion”
LOL — nice qualifier after the fact.
No, I’m not playing your game, Ethan. I don’t come on this site and tell lies. If I did you nutjobs would surely have exposed them, but you never have. Not once.
I provide factual support a lot of times, but I’m not going to start looking for links to prove, for example, that Moveon called a general Betrayus.
And, although I realize that most of you don’t know the difference between your opinions and facts, I do. I don’t claim my opinions are facts, like almost every knucklehead liberal here does, particualarly people like oddjob and rukidding. And you. But I very frequently support my opinions with facts as well. You really need me to put “fact” and “opinion” labels on here for you? I am not your remedial logic and rhetoric teacher.
No qb
Paranoia and fear about our President. I was talking about his speech this morning and was reminded of what his election meant to me. You equated that with radical Isamists, why? Do you believe the President is a radical Islamist?
I like the idea that we need to support assertions with “non-partisan facts.” Is there some other kind of fact?
QB, this is what YOU said: “I am well adjusted, clear thinking, rational, and attendant to truth”
If you’re not willing to put that statement on the line simply by being FAIR and HONEST, then you are truly a coward.
From now on, if you don’t make your posts clearly factual or clearly based on opinion, I am going to ask you if what you wrote is opinion or fact.
You are free to do the same with me.
sbj-
Sorry about that-I thought you were referring to Obama’s ability to see differing points of view in a conflict as some evidence of being a traitor.
Roundup posted, all:
http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/political-media/happy-hour-roundup-110/
@ChuckinDenton: “I thought you were referring to Obama’s ability to see differing points of view in a conflict as some evidence of being a traitor.”
No, that would be crazytalk.
I am simply surprised that more people aren’t calling this Hasan fellow what he is – a traitor. He is a traitor to our country – there has never been a more clear cut case in my lifetime. I hope that all of the “analysis” doesn’t detract from the fact that this traitor took up arms against his own country.
sbj
We all agree Hasan is a traitor for firing on his fellow service men and women, or at least a murderer. What we are cautioning against is jumping to conclusions about his being a Muslim. I thought the President handled that issue quite well.
@lmsinca: It’s the “at least a murderer” part that worries me. He’s a traitor. I’d like to see more teaching of the lesson that traitors are executed and a little less worry about jumping to conclusions. Right after a traitor kills 13 people is not the time to start worrying about how our reaction will impact diversity.
I only read Obama’s remarks but thought they were great.
Sorry sbj, the guy’s in custody and diversity should always be an issue in the criminal courts and everywhere else for that matter.
“Sorry sbj, the guy’s in custody and diversity should always be an issue in the criminal courts and everywhere else for that matter.”
I’d say that we have similar concerns just different priorities.
“What we are cautioning against is jumping to conclusions about his being a Muslim.”
Can’t imagine what this could possibly mean that has any basis in reality. The evidence already made public is that this traitor is a Muslim fanatic and murdered on that basis.
He should be tried and executed asap.
And perhaps if some responsible people had “jumped to conlusions” when he was making threats and contacting affiliates of AQ he wouldn’t have still been in the Army and wouldn’t have committed mass murder.
Your radical 20th century ideology is a contradiction of all the principles on which America was founded.
Your cowardly lust for torture speaks for itself.
Ethan,
“If you’re not willing to put that statement on the line simply by being FAIR and HONEST, then you are truly a coward.”
Meaningless hot air, from someone who habitually is neither fair nor honest. I, on the other hand, am fair and honest, and any time I am not I’m sure a smart guy like you will call me out.
“From now on, if you don’t make your posts clearly factual or clearly based on opinion, I am going to ask you if what you wrote is opinion or fact.
You are free to do the same with me.”
Ask all you want. I know the difference between facts and opinions. Sad for you that you don’t.
Take, for example, your silly assertion above that the U.S. “obviously” went to Iraq for “oil and profiteering,” which you support with a pastiche of non sequiturs very typical for you and moonbats of your stripe. Oh, there are reported “facts” in there, but your “factual” conlusion is just your characterization and opinion, and a rather illogical one at that. (Here is one clue: War opponents are also investing in Iraq.)
No Imsinca, you are again distorting what I said — in fact simply making up something I didn’t say at all. Nothing new for you.
“Paranoia and fear about our President. I was talking about his speech this morning and was reminded of what his election meant to me. You equated that with radical Isamists, why? Do you believe the President is a radical Islamist?”
Simply untrue. You made that up.
And, again, if there is any group of people who should not ever talk about paranoia and fear, it is liberals like those on this site.
“Your cowardly lust for torture speaks for itself.”
Someday, perhaps you’ll come up with an argument rather than just an ad hominem based on a lie. But I doubt it.
And remember, you’re the one who would rather his family die than a terrorist be subjected to the “torture” of having his collar grabbed. Real courageous of you.
Someday, perhaps you’ll come up with an argument rather than just an ad hominem based on a lie. But I doubt it.
Someday you’ll realize it’s not ad hominem, and I am certain of that.
You’re a scary guy for sure.
But I wonder at what point your comments cross the line into personal threats? Yeah, I’d say you’re there.
Sorry you think so. I meant no threat, unless coming to the realization that everything you hold to be true is pernicious bullshit is that threatening to you.
Sooner or later you’ll realize that the entire mental edifice you’ve built your mental life around is a lie.
Hopefully you’ll cope when that happens.
re; traitor.
Yeah, pretty much nails what he is. A member of the military killing other members in cold blood is about as dark and sick as it gets.
Sometimes you have to break it all down to basics: imagine what Washington would have done.
George Washington explicitly repudiated torture.
George Washington believed that to be better than those you are fighting takes the actions of not descending to the depths of those you are fighting.
Far too many right wingers believe that to fight monsters they must become monsters, or as Republican Cheney said, turn to the “darkside”.
And that’s exactly what many right wingers did: Many right wingers turned to the “darkside” and became exactly like the monsters they claimed they were fighting.
Just What is Obama Hiding? Shocking info:
http://www.35energy.com/news/just-what-is-obama-hiding.html
This is cute.
Now, why would a right-winger falsely imply that the reality-based community has slapped the label “chickenhawk” on four Republicans who are well-known to have served in wartime?
Maybe it’s because the right has no effective defense against the fact-based charge that the GOP is shot through — metaphorically speaking, of course — with chickenhawks.
Speaking of which, the New and Improved Chickenhawk Database is now online.
i just only 15 i think that the government have something to it cause how can 1 guy on a base full with other guy with gun or protection hurt 30 or 14 people to me something not right they are covering something up to me