The Morning Plum
* Telling? Obama says in a new interview that he doesn’t want his successor to inherit the Afghanistan war, adding that a “multi-year occupation” doesn’t serve U.S. interests.
* Key number from the new WaPo poll on Afghanistan: Only 44% think the war is worth its cost, a new low. The question is whether Obama can turn public skepticism around by clearly articulating our goals.
* Call in the air cover! The labor-backed Americans United For Change and AFSCME are going up with a massive ad counteroffensive defending over a dozen House Dems who voted for the reform proposal and are now getting pummeled by opponents:
The ad, which urges each member of Congress “not to back down” and to “keep fighting for us,” is meant to reassure jittery Dems that they will have massive backing if they stand firm and vote for the final proposal.
* Senator Dick Durbin, on CNN last night, declined to say a health care bill would be complete before the State of the Union address in January. “I wouldn’t predict that,” he said, per a transcript. Privately, Dems acknowledge that getting it done by then is a must.
* Understatement of the day: Anti-Defamation League concludes that the views of Glenn Beck and the Tea Party brigade are “colored by a streak of paranoia.”
* Bart Stupak, on David Axelrod’s claim that his anti-abortion amendment should be adjusted: “Mr. Axelrod is not a legislator. He doesn’t really know what he is talking about.”
* Key moderate Senate Dems appear to be growing more willing to allow the Democratically-elected majority party to debate a health care bill.
* But Senator Ben Nelson, for one, appears to be extracting a price: He wants Senate leaders to nix plans to strip the insurance companies of their antitrust exemption.
* Quote of the day, from Dana Milbank: “In their quest to thwart President Obama, Republicans do not fear the hobgoblin of consistency.”
* The Recovery.gov mess keeps getting messier.
* And here’s Wolf Blitzer, promoting a piece that ran on CNN: “Jessica Yellin did a very good report in SitRoom on Sarah Palin and her sexuality — the fact that she’s good looking. Did you see it?”
What else is happening?
Update: White House senior communications adviser Dan Pfeiffer keeps up the fact-checking of Fox.
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Don’t you mean “Obama says in a new interview that he doesn’t want his successor to inherit the Afghanistan war” ?
Why yes, I do mean that. Fixed. Thanks.
For a moment there, I thought Obama was ‘losing it’.
Good BBC sobering piece on America’s banker.
“It should not come as a surprise that President Obama has been dancing delicately and deftly around the issues of Tibet and human rights while on his visit to China.
Who after all would kick sand in their banker’s face? China now holds reserves of $2.3 trillion. It owns more US debt than anyone else.
China’s savings sustain the US economy for better or worse. It is the financial equivalent of assured mutual destruction.
The Chinese underwrite America’s lavish lifestyle. Their family silver is kept in dollars. One can not live without the other. But you can see why Barack Obama has been at pains to be a most courteous guest. ”
…
“I can also see why the Chinese hate being lectured by America on human rights.
The lingering existence of Guantanamo Bay and memories of Abu Ghraib have eroded the moral high ground like a swarm of termites, however insistently Obama has banned the use of torture.
But something else has changed in the chemistry of the world’s most important bilateral relationship. America is now more in awe of China than vice versa.
Afghanistan and Iraq have shown the limits of US military power. We are no longer impressed, as we once were, by million-dollar smart bombs if crude but deadly IEDs planted in drinks cans can kill or injure American soldiers on a daily basis.
The stonewalling, sandbagging and petty in-fighting on Capitol Hill have shown the limits of democracy in the world’s greatest democracy. And the Great Recession has shown the limits of America’s economic clout. ”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/programmes/world_news_america/8365563.stm
What will the wingnuts propose next ? Bomb, Bomb, China ?
Israeli lebensraum continues apace…
“The Jerusalem city government moved forward Tuesday with plans to build a Jewish neighborhood in East Jerusalem, which Palestinians claim for their future capital.” http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1129053.html
“President Barack Obama, who pledged to eradicate childhood hunger, has described as “unsettling” the agriculture department survey, which says 50 million people in the US – one in six of the population – were unable to afford to buy sufficient food to stay healthy at some point last year, in large part because of escalating unemployment or poorly paid jobs.” http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/17/millions-hungry-households-us-report
I don’t think that Palin or FOX or Limbaugh or unceasing Republican obstructionism will hurt Dems more than Republicans themselves UNLESS this economic situation gets going strongly in the other direction.
Toss in a negative modifier, please.
Tomasky does rah rah for “Going Rouge”… http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/michaeltomasky/2009/nov/17/sarah-palin-going-rouge
The world’s least necessary quotation marks. From today’s NRO…
- [Palin] says she’s had a chance to look at the Crist-Rubio race “just on the surface.” -
Dana Milbank: “In their quest to thwart President Obama, Republicans do not fear the hobgoblin of consistency.”
I’m not a fan of Milbank but I’d like to thank him for pointing out the obvious.
It’s The Right Wing’s First Rule: Rules Are For Other People.
Modern day Republican leaders are deeply unprincipled people.
While I distinguish the unprincipled Republican leadership from their right wing base, the fact that the base keeps voting for those deeply unscrupulous Republican leaders puts in question their principles.
Try this one, Congressman Stupak: “Rep. Stupak does not have a uterus. He doesn’t really know what he is talking about.”
Wolf Blitzer
Why is this horrid, stupid, vapid airhead on the air???
I suspect Obama’s “dithering” over Afghanistan is based on the historical lesson he has learned from Vietnam. The Generals are saying precisely the same things as they did in the 60’s. He can easily see how 40,000 leads to another 50,000, well let’s put the pedal to the metal and bring in 100,000 and really seal the deal and before you know…presto you have a half million troops in country…still unable to win a war without a definable victory.
I believe Obama is drawing the proverbial line in the sand with his advisors….WHAT IS THE EXIT STRATEGY AND WHEN? It’s the obvious question but apparently his advisors are unable to come up with an answer.
The country is tired of this stupid military adventurism. Alas my 85 year old mother is a Faux news lover and love Beck. She confessed yesterday that Afghanistan is a waste of lives and money. She is worried about the deficit big time and at least she has the consistency to not only wish to deep six HCR but also the foreign wars. I too am completely over this war without end and so while I realize two people do not a statistical example make…it’s two people from polar opposites…the far right and the very progressive actually AGREEING on something.
Get the hell out of Afghanistan!
“Rep. Stupak does not have a uterus. He doesn’t really know what he is talking about.”
Well played, and worth repeating. Often.
(I can’t resist)
“I’m going to have to prove myself to some people — if they have an open mind — by actions and not just words.”
That’s Palin to NRO’s Lowry and Costa (continuing the panting lounge-lizards version of conservative intellectualism).
What “actions”? You quit to avoid actions. Even the “words” aren’t “your” words, Sarah. They’re written for you. For example, “commonsense conservatism”, that spiffy new Luntzian alliterative slogan.
One might have presumed that the NRO/Weekly Standard crowd would have have some actual standards re integrity and honesty but they just keep going straight down into the bidet.
It’s the obvious question but apparently his advisors are unable to come up with an answer.
And that is when you realize that Sen. Feinstein was probably correct in her analysis when she said a couple of weeks ago that she does not believe that at this point in time Afghanistan is ready to be a democracy with a functioning central government in the sense that a “country” typically is. I don’t recall that it’s ever really had that and I don’t think you can export it to Afghanistan via military occupation.
Palin’s actions to date are the actions of a celebrity riding a gravy train. I like Tena’s characterization of Palin – the Paris Hilton of American politics.
What else is happening?
“those offended by the legal privileges being given to Mohammed by trying him in a civilian court ultimately won’t find it “offensive at all when he’s convicted and when the death penalty is applied to him.”
Obama on NYC Trial
“We need not cower in the face of this enemy,” Holder says. “Our institutions are strong, our infrastructure is sturdy, our resolve is firm, and our people are ready.”
It is a fact that the Party of No and Fear are unable to govern and when one does try to Govern and accomplish things for the American people like healthcare, raising the minimum wage or continuing unemployment benefits, they continue to “huff and puff” and spew fear in the air in hopes that people will continue to stay depressed and afraid thereby immobilizing and paralyzing them to do anything at all. Now the GOP are huffing and puffing about the Obama Decision of having the terrorists being tried in open court in New York. Of course, we should bring these men to Justice, this should have been done a long time ago. Some of us may know that (”Saturn is in Libra, the significator of fair trials and justice.” – Colloboratewithblogspot.com) which may be bringing this event to the forefront. And, it may be also that the GOP are just angry and embarrassed that they could not accomplish this very basic task of holding these terrorists accountable for their acts! I would not even be surprised if Team Obama finds Bin Laden, something Bush & Co. were also incapable of doing. Would this anger the GOP too? Probably!
As far as Obama bowing to the Japanese the Bible teaches us in Matthew 20:26 “It is not this way among you, but whoever wishes to become great among you shall be your servant.” which signfies to me that President Obama is a great man.
Like I said. I think in a time like this, some Americans are looking for leadership. Obama, by coming out strong on this one, would come out ahead and change public perception on these trials in Federal courts.
Another notable quote from that article.
“I think this notion that we have to be fearful that these terrorists possess some special powers that prevent us from presenting evidence against them, locking them up and exacting swift justice, I think that has been a fundamental mistake,” Obama said in an interview with CNN.
Sounds just about like what many of us where arguing for here yesterday.
Bill Kristol’s latest memo – short version…
“It appears unseemly when we speak forthrightly regarding our passionate hope that Obama will fail at anything and everything he attempts. Also, it would be best if we don’t mention that we are working diligently every second of each day to bring this passionate hope to fruition.
It is prudent to forward the pretense that you wish the President well.”
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/017/213yivpg.asp?pg=1
Republican Sarah “Paris Hilton of American politics” Palin.
Sums up Palin’s vapidity, her vanity, and her tabloidydness.*
* tabloidydness, for lack of a better word I made one up.
Greg, that piece on the paranoia from the right flank, extreme though it may be, is really frightening. I was reading something a couple of weeks ago that had a link to “Oath Keepers” and they are all about resistance to a government they believe to be illegitimate. I find it disturbing to see them mentioned twice in as many weeks.
“the Paris Hilton of American politics.”
Paris is so yesterday. Next phase, Levi Johnston/Carrie Prejean video leak.
Bill O’Reilly has just forthrightly admitted that he doesn’t “care about the Constitution”. The Weekly Standard doesn’t either.
“Even for The Weekly Standard, this bitter, juvenile McCarthyite attack on the ACLU by Thomas Joscelyn sputters with so much fact-free, impotent, and self-defeating rage that it’s hard to believe it was printed…” http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/
Since you are mostly idiots and children who comment here, you probably don’t know this old saw: when you owe the bank a million dollars, that’s your problem; when you owe the bank $100 million, that’s the banks problem.
What is your big concern about China, geniuses? I thought comrade Obama clearly gets it, since he appears hellbent on hyperinflating the currency.
“hellbent on hyperinflating the currency.”
Inflating who’s currency? China’s? If so, yes you are correct. We would prefer China not artificially devalue their currency, which introduces unfair trading practices. Maybe the WTO along with the President can step in and put pressure on China.
Or do you have a better idea?
What a freak show. This woman must be stopped: http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/palin-on-muslim-profiling-im-all-for-it.php
“Telling? Obama says in a new interview that he doesn’t want his successor to inherit the Afghanistan war, adding that a “multi-year occupation” doesn’t serve U.S. interests.”
Is it telling? Is it to me – this is what I want to hear; that he gets that this has been going on fruitlessly now for 8 or 9 years and that if he gets trapped there it’s going to be fatal.
“Since you are mostly idiots and children who comment here, you probably don’t know this old saw: when you owe the bank a million dollars, that’s your problem; when you owe the bank $100 million, that’s the banks problem.”
Your brilliant is breathtaking – thanks for that. I see it all clearly now.
“* Key number from the new WaPo poll on Afghanistan: Only 44% think the war is worth its cost, a new low. The question is whether Obama can turn public skepticism around by clearly articulating our goals.”
Greg,
Why is that the question, and why would he want to turn the public skepticism around? I do not understand what you are driving at. It appears to me, since the public have grown justifiably weary of the no win Afghanistan quagmire, President Obama would be better off to start reducing the number of Troops we have over there. The public would support that more, than they would sending another 40,000 troops into that 14th century morass.
# oddjob | November 18th, 2009 at 09:27 am
Palin’s actions to date are the actions of a celebrity riding a gravy train. I like Tena’s characterization of Palin – the Paris Hilton of American politics.
………………….
I am sorry my friend. You got that from me, and not from Tena. You even noted that you were going to make use of it. I wrote that Quitter Palin was just a Paris Hilton for Right Wing Christians.
CBO report today with special caucus meeting this evening.
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/reid-to-unveil-health-care-bill-to-caucus-at-evening-meeting.php
I think this comparison does a disservice to Paris Hilton. I watched the video. She didn’t quit.
” the Paris Hilton of American politics.
………………….
I am sorry my friend. You got that from me, and not from Tena”
No I said that yesterday. I didn’t know you had already. Sorry.
My bad! I forgot you had mentioned it previously!
The reason I said it is because she’s going to wind up being a celebrity just because she is one. Famous for being famous.
@Bernie,
I was pointing it out in the context of how one can be a modern celbrity, without having any real body of work. Paris is just famous for being famous, and gets paid very large appearance fees for just being famous.
I see Quitter Palin as someone who is doing pretty much the same thing, on the Right Wing Christian circuit.
Here is something that I think you will enjoy:
http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/0/q/2/winner-never-quits.jpg
“aris is just famous for being famous, and gets paid very large appearance fees for just being famous.”
That’s what I was saying yesterday = we’re on the exact same page.
@Tena and Oddjob.
No big deal. I wrote my comparison of Quitter to Paris, more than a week ago, and it may have just seeped into your subconscious.
Probably Liam.
Here is another one for Bernie.
I think the rest of you will enjoy it also.
Hockey Mom, and Pit-bull
http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/3/q/2/palin-pit-bull-quitter.gif
Ben Nelson takes the bait:
“Based on information from the Justice Department, the Federal Trade Commission, the National Association of Insurance Commissioners, consumer groups, and private attorneys, CBO estimates that both of those effects would be very small, and thus that enacting the legislation would have no significant effect on the premiums that private insurers would charge for health insurance”
was wondering all along if it wasn’t bait for the more recalcitrant Senators
http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/26/repealing-insurance-antitrust-exemption-all-smoke-no-fire/
Liam – thanks for the cartoons!
Rick Perlstein gives a truly extraordinary little lecture at the following link. I really recommend that you folks listen to it… http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiwert/perlstein-post-partisanship-millions
@Greg – I’ll likely bump you again on this one later in case you don’t see this formal request (consider that it arrives in top hat and tails) that you link this Perlstein piece at daily roundup.
Love Rick Perlstein.
We used to email occasionally way way back when he wrote for the Village Voice.
Tena – Have you read Nixonland? It’s a brilliant bit of historical research and writing. This is one smart dude.
Bernie = I have not and I’m glad you reminded me.
““The Jerusalem city government moved forward Tuesday with plans to build a Jewish neighborhood in East Jerusalem, which Palestinians claim for their future ca”
[poundingforeheadbloodyonkeyboard]
Bernie I’m glad you can bear to read Ha’aretz and keep us posted on Israel and Palestine because I cannot bear it.
The so-called “Recovery.gov mess” is just another example of the way the MSM conflates things that look like “gotcha’s” to stupid people with reporting.
ABC and Issa have put on their indignation panties and given them a 180 degree twist because “ABC News has reported in recent days that Recovery.gov lists scores of jobs and millions of dollars in spending in congressional districts that do not exist.”
So basically, what we have is a lot of manufactured outraged pitched by the innumerate (i.e. the same political reporters who breathlessly reported on Hillary’s gutsy comeback long after she was mathematically precluded from getting the nomination) to the innumerate (Republicans) based upon their inability to grasp the difference in scale between the “millions” their vaporing about and the 700 billion appropriated.
Well, let me see if I can help provide some perspective. When accounting for inventory at retail, accountants expect to see 2-3% slippage due to ordinary human error–failure to properly account for damaged merchandise thrown away, cash register errors, simple miscounting starting at the factory and ending at the store, and, of course, the odd bit of shoplifting.
Let’s assume the worst case. Let’s say ABC’s “millions” add up to the horrendous sum of 100 million. One hundred million is fourteen one hundredths of one percent (0.014%) of seven hundred billion.
If we’re going to clutch our pearls and thunder in outrage over a .014% accounting slippage, i’d say we’re demanding adherence to an inhuman standard of perfection. Yeah, a million is a lot of money to you and me, but the harsh mathetmatical reality is that it’s sofa cushion change on a project of this scale.
Did anyone here honestly think Reid wouldn’t be able to muster the votes to start a debate? Even I stated that I would allow debate to start. The trick will be getting the votes to end debate, and taht isn’t going to happen. My colleague Sen. Carper stated explicitly last night that the public option would not garner sixty votes. No public option will pass the Senate, period.
The Obama Record: Record unemployment, record deficits, no legislative accomplishments.
“It’s The Right Wing’s First Rule: Rules Are For Other People”
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah, what an absolute idiot you are. So let me get this straight: The Democrats filibustered pretty much everything they opposed when they were the minority party. They even took the unprecedented step of filibustering judicial nominees, and now when the Republicans are doing it, and the Democrats complain, it is the Republicans who are the hypocrites? If anything, both parties are being equally hypocritical. But claiming it is only the Republican Party that is being inconsistent, after all the filibustering they did during the Bush years, is a joke.
“While I distinguish the unprincipled Republican leadership from their right wing base, the fact that the base keeps voting for those deeply unscrupulous Republican leaders puts in question their principles.”
And the right probably feels the same way about Democratic Party votes. Again, anyone pretending that politicians on both sides are not corrupt and unscrupulous is a naive moron and a partisan hack.
The Obama Record: Record unemployment, record deficits, no legislative accomplishments.
Steve, Biden was on the Daily Show last night and slammed critics of the recovery.gov site. He said the whole thing amounts to 70 people who didn’t fill out their forms right. No money was spent that wasn’t accounted for, yadda yadda. Such a waste of time. Obviously it should be right, but is it a CONTROVERSY? Obviously not.
Recovery.gov doesn’t show anything except money spent. It shows nothing at all about net job creation. It is fantasyland.
“The so-called “Recovery.gov mess” is just another example of the way the MSM conflates things that look like “gotcha’s” to stupid people with reporting.”
Yeah, you are so right, this is over nothing and is no big deal. The fact that there were 875 congressional districts listed on the site, when there are only really 435? THE SITE MORE THAN DOUBLED THE AMOUNT OF CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS THAT ACTUALLY EXIST. But evidently, that is no big deal. The response of the Obamabot sycophants on this site:
“So basically, what we have is a lot of manufactured outraged[sic]….”
Hey genius, let me see if I can put that in scale for YOU. So they were off by oh, roughly 102%. But hey, no big deal, right? This “manufactured outrage” over an obvious fraud is all just a figment of the media’s imagination. There is nothing to see here.
The fact that most every major newspaper in the US, including the Chicago Tribune, The Boston Globe, The LA Times, The NY Times and The Washington Post, is starting to find more and more examples of outright lies with the data? Just manufactured outrage. Only a fraction of the bogus “jobs saved” data has been examined, and daily we are hearing of more examples of outright lies being told to inflate those numbers. But when the government is perpetrating a fraud, that’s no biggie, evidently because the “president” has a D behind his name.
Also, anyone using the $700 Billion number to discuss this is an absolute jackass. Only a fraction of that money has been dispersed and spent, so using a “it was only millions out of $700 Billion” “argument” is flat-out wrong. And even if it were “only millions” that is completely irrelevant. This is not human error we are talking about, this is outright decpetion, unless of course you are enough of a partisan hack to actually believe it was a mistake to list more than double the actual amount of Congressional districts that exist. It’s only a “so-called mess” instead of a real one if you are an sycophantic Obamabot who can’t bring himself to criticize the “president” or his administration no matter what happens.
The Obama Record: Record unemployment, record deficits, no legislative accomplishments.
“Obviously it should be right, but is it a CONTROVERSY? Obviously not.”
Well, Joe Biden said it, so it must be true. Again, anyone claiming that a more-than-doubling of congressional districts is not a controversy is a sycophant. And the $6.4 BILLION, not million, BILLION that was listed as being spent in those districts? No big deal either.
Sheesh, it is hard to believe anyone can worship a politician, a politician for Christ sake, so much that they are willing to offer up pathetic defenses of everything he or his administration does. I don’t think I will call you sycophants anymore, because that word doesn’t even begin to touch it.
The Obama Record: Record unemployment, record deficits, no legislative accomplishments.
Do you even know what the word sycophant means?
If we Dems are such sycophants then why do we want UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE?
Please answer idiot troll:
If we Dems are such sycophants then why do we want UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE?
“Bernie I’m glad you can bear to read Ha’aretz and keep us posted on Israel and Palestine because I cannot bear it.”
Tena – Haaretz is actually a very good paper aside from being particularly informative re the middle east. Liberal Israeli voices (and anti-occupation voices within Israel) are covered in Haaretz far more commonly and thoroughly than they are in US (or, to a lesser extent) Canadian) papers. Reading just newspapers over here can give one a very false impression of the range of Israeli public sentiment.
Gee wow, Troll Liar didn’t respond. Shocker.
Ambinder has a nice, biting post up:
http://politics.theatlantic.com/2009/11/karl_roves_self-aggrandizing_title.php
Arguing with a manipulative deceiver like right winger Joe Lie berman will leave you questioning his sanity.
Certainly it’s stupid to make mistakes reporting the Recovery.gov stats.
It was also stupid to follow the right wing’s fantasy economic system that put US in the Republican’s 2007 Great Recession in the first place.
The only thing that kept US out of a Second Republican Great Depression was the stimulus money.
Right winger Joe Lie bermann’s job is to complain about the weeds in a forest filled with his lies.