Reid, Lieberman Offices Both Strongly Deny Report That Lieberman Won’t Filibuster
Hate to be the bearer of this news, but aides to both Harry Reid and Joe Lieberman are adamantly denying an explosive report this morning that the two men have a private “understanding” to the effect that Lieberman won’t join a filibuster on a health care bill.
Reid spokesman Jim Manley emails me:
There is no such understanding. We hope to have his vote in the end but we are not there yet.
Meanwhile, Lieberman spokesman Marshall Wittmann emails a strong denial, too:
If you believe this story is true, you will also believe that I am replacing A Rod in game six of the series. There is absolutely no “private understanding.”…Senator Lieberman’s unambiguously clear position, both in private and in public, is that he will vote for the motion to proceed to the health care bill because he supports health care reform that will control costs and insure people who don’t have it now, but will oppose cloture on a final bill if it contains a public option.
The two spokesman were denying a report in this morning’s Hill in which anonymous sources claimed that the two Senators had reached “a private understanding” that Lieberman “will not block a final vote on healthcare reform.”
Judging by Manley’s statement — “we are not there yet” — private discussions are underway. But no deal.
***********************************
Update: A Democrat close to Lieberman offers Sam Stein a glimpse of Lieberman’s thinking:
“My sense of it is he is using his leverage to try and make the bill as fiscally sound as possible. I also tend to think that there are a bunch of moderates who feel the same exact way he does but who can’t say it publicly for risk of being savaged,” the source said.
“I don’t know,” how he will end up voting. “I don’t think he knows yet. If you knew that ahead of time he would have no leverage. If you are trying to influence a process and you are using the leverage of your vote and then say ‘I’m giving away my vote and am going to stamp my feet,’ then you have lost your leverage.”
Or, as Lieberman himself recently put it, “I feel relevant.”
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One can only hope that Reid will take steps to strip JoeLIE of his gavel and rank and anything else he can. I am horrified at the idea that ONE senator can block anything from coming to a vote, much less something that constituents overwhelmingly favor.
Of course he won’t. Neither will any Dem. And here’s why:
In general, would you say that President Obama’s views and proposed programs for the country are
too liberal, not liberal enough, or just about right for the country?
42% Too liberal, 14% Not liberal enough, 44% About right
58% of the country thinks Barack Obama’s Liberal ideology is just right or not Liberal enough.
58%.
Ethan-
Nice.
“58% of the country thinks Barack Obama’s Liberal ideology is just right or not Liberal enough.
58%.”
I told y’all that this is not a conservative country. There are no conservatives left, except the middle of the Democratic Party. The GOP is not conservative.
I believe a lot of people started labeling themselves as “conservatives” without knowing what that means, because if you talk to them, they hold liberal views on everything but choice.
The anti-choice crusaders started this modern conservative movement. The big money guys like the Bushes thought they ran the thing, but they didn’t. They got run. And this brand of rightwing ideology is anything but conserative. As we all know, it’s very extremist and one thing I believe Americans are very much not is extremist.
I’m usually not a violent person but would tacks under Lieberman’s fingernails be justified for a vote on cloture on this? Or maybe even just a noogie or a massive charlie horse.
Just curious I guess.
Big Republican Donor in FL Takes the Money and Runs
The news hit with the shock of a thunderclap: South Florida super attorney Scott Rothstein, political operator and philanthropist with a zest for sports cars and living large, was accused by his broke law firm Monday of looting investor accounts and was nowhere to be found.
How much money may be missing remains unclear, but Jeffrey Sonn, a securities litigation attorney hired by one investor, said it could be more than $100 million.
As of Monday night, no one — not even Rothstein’s own attorney — knew where he was, and speculation ranged from Morocco to Venezuela.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/broward/fort-lauderdale/sfl-rothstein-law-firm-b110109,0,4262229.story
Contributions:
http://www.sun-sentinel2.com/ftlaudrothstein/ftlaudrothstein_list.php?pagesize=500
Just another GOP scammer. $100M this time.
mike – Lieberman is in Lieberman Heaven. He’s getting just what he wanted – loads of attention.
I’ll bet anyone right now $50 that he doesn’t filibuster. He just wants the attention.
I think here is where the mix up regarding conservatism stands.
I’d consider myself a fiscally conservative person. I save a substantial amount of my pay. I pay my bill off either on time or early. I pay off debt as quick as possible
Does that make me a conservative? Maybe fiscally. It doesn’t make me an ideologue that rejects economic notions that Govn’t is the spender of last resort during tough recessions and the private sector cannot maintain the debt the Govn’t can during these times and remain solvent.
You can push for liberal policies and still be fiscally, or conservatively smart about it.
“How much money may be missing remains unclear, but Jeffrey Sonn, a securities litigation attorney hired by one investor, said it could be more than $100 million.”
I read that – amazing piece. All I could think was: the last 8 years, was everybody in the game? How many more of these people whose entire lives and fortunes are just con jobs, are going to bob-up to the surface?
I’m with you Mike. I am very conservative with my money and try not to expose our business to too much risk. We don’t rely on credit to propel ourselves forward and I consider that being fiscally conservative.
MsMolly and Tena-Here’s a better article than Arianna’s over at HuffPo. From Robert Creamer.
“I know there are many Progressives who are disappointed at the pace of change, or who believe that there are many instances when the Obama administration should take bolder action. Sometimes I am among them. But there is no question that in the first nine months of his presidency, Barack Obama has begun to lead America in a fundamentally new direction. The success of this new progressive project will certainly depend on the decisions that he and those around him make in the years ahead. But it will also depend on the skill, resilience and resourcefulness of the progressive forces in America.”
Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-creamer/one-year-after-obamas-vic_b_343465.html
Tena: Yeah, and he will drag it out as long as he can. Which means we’ll have his baggy visage and sonorous drone on our teevees for far too long. SIGH.
And I guess I’m also a fiscal conservative, but ideologically and socially very liberal. (My sister thinks I’m a left-wingnut.)
“You can push for liberal policies and still be fiscally, or conservatively smart about it”
I know you know this but anyone who is a real fiscal conservative has figured out by now – or better have – that you cannot trust the GOP with your tax dollars. We got the tax and spend label just for social programs. The GOP, true to form, always spends about 3 times more when they have control over the money, than the Democrats do.
The GOP is responsible for the damned deficit in the first place. They were handed a surplus that they squandered in the first 4 years and then spent the last 4 digging the debt hole deeper.
The Bush Legacy: Death, Destruction and Debt.
they hold liberal views on everything but choice
I could be wrong, but even there my understanding is that, on the whole, Americans’ views on abortion have been more or less constant since before Roe v. Wade. They are personally uneasy with abortion, but want to have access to it.
It is amazing that this man is even allowed to think he has any leverage. He has his chairmanship because of democrats and to think that he has some leverage is absurd.
This just shows the continued weakness of Harry Reid as majority leader.
oddjob = I think you’re right about that. I am not saying, nor have I, that there was ever a “conservative majority,” self-identified or objectively identified.
If there had been, there wouldn’t have been so many close elections.
I know you know this but anyone who is a real fiscal conservative has figured out by now – or better have – that you cannot trust the GOP with your tax dollars.
WORD!!!! The GOP borrows and spends like no tomorrow, which is FAR worse!
“continued weakness of Harry Reid as majority leader.:”
I’m not a fan – although, Harry has led on health care reform here at the end. My main problem with harshing on Harry is that I haven’t paid this close attention to any other Senate Majority Leader. I don’t know how others have done under similar circumstances. Without knowing that, I have a hard time blaming Reid for everything.
@Kris,
The Senate Democrats are not to blame. They were going to strip Lieberman of his Seniority in the Caucus, but President Obama intervened on Leiberman’s behalf.
I also want to add that if Lieberman is the one person blocking the public option and Harry Reid gives into his demands versus the rest of the damn caucus–he’s toast next year.
I think Lieberman is bluffing because there is no way in hell Harry gets reelected if he bows to this fool.
“WORD!!!! The GOP borrows and spends like no tomorrow, which is FAR worse!”
My husband is a real fiscal conservative, too, and the way Bush and his Congress burned through money like it was old newspapers absolutely appalled and infuriated him.
He’s a huge Obama fan. For one thing, they approach problems similarly and they have similar low-key styles. Mr. Tena is no drama to the extreme.
Liam–
There are democrats that supported Lieberman keeping his gavel even without Obama’s blessing.
Everything is now on the table as we get closer to a vote and we will know EXACTLY who is blocking health care in the caucus. Harry is screwed if he gives into Lieberman and I would like to hope that he realizes this.
Liam
That’s because Obama, unlike the right wing “leaders”, prefers to keep the moderates in the fold. We see what is happening with conservatives vs. moderates and I don’t think it would be good strategy from the WH to try to emulate that.
I know a lot of progressives would just love to get rid of the Blue Dogs, and I’m not a big fan of them either, but we need a large majority in order to keep things rolling. It’s better to try to persuade them than just get rid of them, especially when you consider the alternative. YIKES!!
Irony of ironies: Mr. Tena is a better dancer than Obama. I really love it that we have a black president and he can’t dance.
“We see what is happening with conservatives vs. moderates and I don’t think it would be good strategy from the WH to try to emulate that.”
{{{{{SWOON!!!!}}}}}
That kind of sensible talk overloads all my senses these days cause it’s rare.
Insimca,
I understood why President Obama intervened on behalf of Leiberman. At that time, we did not know who was going to win the Minnesota seat, and we needed every vote we could round up. I just want people to stop beating up on Senator Reid for doing exactly what President Obama asked for.
Here’s a pretty good take on Lieberman from The New Republic. A little different from Ezra’s analysis.
“Pretty much everything Lieberman has done since his unsuccessful presidential campaign in 2004–including, now, his threats to kill the public option–has been designed to infuriate Democrats. It’s almost as if, having been hurt so badly by their rejection at the polls, he needs them to stay angry at him (rather than just forget about him). Remember, plenty of Democratic Senators continued to support the war in Iraq after it went south; Lieberman was the only one who regularly voiced that support on the op-ed page of the Wall Street Journal in articles that lavished praise on President Bush and chided Democrats for not being sufficiently appreciative of his leadership skills.”
http://www.tnr.com/blog/the-plank/overthinking-lieberman
Seriously though, somebody important needs to point out that tax and spend comes out to deficit neutral as opposed to tax-cut and spend…
Isn’t it ironic that one unstable and unethical man from a small state can hold the HCR to ransom and yet no one can anything about it ?
“But there is no question that in the first nine months of his presidency, Barack Obama has begun to lead America in a fundamentally new direction. The success of this new progressive project will certainly depend on the decisions that he and those around him make in the years ahead. But it will also depend on the skill, resilience and resourcefulness of the progressive forces in America.””
Very well said – thanks.
What I hate about this argument on the left the most, is that in supporting the prez, I end up in a position where I get accused of being in a cult. Maybe I do like the man for a lot of reasons beyond his role as president – and I do. I like his background, his style, I love his family and I think electing him was the best thing we’ve done, maybe ever.
But we handed him the biggest mess imaginable. Bush and the GOP ran riot in this country – look at all the con men who were out there raking in the money while they could. The last 8 years was one long robbery. And while Bush was clearing brush and leaving running things to Dick Cheney, who has had his blood run through so many damn machines now that he is the walking embodiment of pump-head – the whole country ran onto the reefs. Nobody was paying any attention.
Everything is broken. Everything – from FEMA to the DOJ, every bureau was rotten. They left us no money, a pile of debt, two wars, impossible domestic problems they caused and walked two steps away, turned around and said: we aren’t going to let you clean it up, either. We’re going to fight everything you want to do.
No president will ever – at least in my lifetime = be as liberal as I am. Maybe eventually, but not any time soon.
Lieberman must think we’re as stupid as wingnuts! If he’s not going to block the bill from getting to the floor which he’s already said he wouldn’t, joining the Republicans for a filibuster of the bill’s passage would require 60 Democrats voting to filibuster was well. Joe is not relevant and after 2010 when we pick up another 2 seats at least, he’ll be officially dead!
lmsinca – Why it is I’m not convinced that joe’s “concern” for “fiscal” responsibility in re HCR is for real ?
Tena-
I won’t take that bet.
“Here’s a pretty good take on Lieberman from The New Republic. A little different from Ezra’s analysis.”
I think Ezra is just flat wrong – I think the New Republic is dead-on.
Tena, here’s a post I made last night that will interest you being from Texas and all. It’s one of those under the radar Obama stories you like.
I found something local that might interest our immigration enthsiasts on both sides. While we’re all focused elsewhere the Obama Administration has re-focused deportations on the hardened criminal elements of illegals, a pretty stark departure from the Bush years of just round up anybody. I don’t think anyone on the right can complain about this, but you never know.
“Newly compiled data show that in fiscal year 2009, which ended Sept. 30, the number of criminal illegal immigrants arrested by Immigration and Customs Enforcement fugitive-operations teams doubled, from more than 7,900 in fiscal year 2008 to almost 16,000.
The number of non-criminals arrested plummeted during the same year, from more than 26,200 to fewer than 19,200.”
“Earlier this year, ICE Assistant Secretary John Morton directed ICE’s field offices to go through files on illegal immigrants with standing deportation orders and put criminals at the top of the stack, said Matt Chandler, a spokesman for the Department of Homeland Security, which includes ICE. A criminal is defined as someone convicted of a crime or a suspect with an outstanding criminal warrant.”
http://www.pe.com/localnews/immigration/stories/PE_News_Local_S_return02.41b39f4.html
ChuckinDenton – I don’t think anybody else will, either.
amk-
re: “small state”. I see what you are getting at but I’ve seen that same argument several times recently in the commet section of blogs and I just don’t buy it. Any senator from any state, regardless of population, can hold the process “hostage” and I’m sure larger population senators have done it.
Imsinca = let me tell you what a big deal that really is. THere is a concentration camp in the middle of my state for immigrants and the Bush Administration locked up families with CHILDREN in a damn private prison in the middle of Texas.
I think they are slowly trying to straighten out the mess in immigration and I’m hoping that they close that thing. I know all the families with small children are being released next month.
The place has haunted me for years- it’s a by-god concentration camp. One aging Jewish man from Dallas read about a Palestinian family locked up there and spent a fortune getting them released to his custody because to him it was like Germany in 1935, but this time it was Muslims and he really got it.
I digress – thanks for that post.
And anyone who gets impatient about immigration – at the best of times the immigration authorities are about 2 – 4 years behind. I understand there was almost chaos in that bureau during the Bush years.
“I really love it that we have a black president and he can’t dance.”
!
Stereotype much?
Greg,
You might want to start to monitor this situation. It has great potential to wreck the Democrat’s Congressional Caucus.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20091103/pl_politico/29055
Excerpts
“The House ethics committee is currently investigating seven African-American lawmakers — more than 15 percent of the total in the House. And an eighth black member, Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. (D-Ill.), would be under investigation if the Justice Department hadn’t asked the committee to stand down.
Not a single white lawmaker is currently the subject of a full-scale ethics committee probe.”
“A document leaked to The Washington Post last week showed that nearly three dozen lawmakers have come under scrutiny this year by either the House ethics committee or the Office of Congressional Ethics, an independent watchdog created in 2008 at the insistence of Pelosi. While the list contained a substantial number of white lawmakers, the ethics committee has not yet launched formal investigative subcommittees with respect to any of them — as it has with the seven African-American members.”
Here’s some great info from The Democratic Strategist for all you poll enthusiasts.
TDS Co-Editor Ruy Teixeira: Right’s Blame Game Falls Flat
by staff, November 3, 2009 10:21 AM EST
TDS Co_Editor Ruy Teixeira’s latest ‘Public Opinion Snapshot’ at the Center for American Progress web pages takes a look at conservatives’ success in propagating the “It’s Obama’s fault” meme regarding health care and the economy. Teixeira shows pretty conclusively that the public isn’t buying it. On the economy:
…A new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll finds just 20 percent blaming Obama’s policies for current economic conditions, compared to 63 percent who say this is a situation Obama has inherited.
On the difficulty of securing health care reform:
…A question in the same poll also asked respondents who was to blame for making health care reform legislation so difficult to pass. Almost half—49 percent—said “special interest groups such as big pharmaceutical and health insurance companies” deserved “a great deal of blame” and another 26 percent thought these special interests deserved “quite a bit of blame.” By comparison, just 18 percent thought Obama deserved a great deal of blame and another 20 percent thought he deserved quite a bit of blame. Almost three-fifths (58 percent) thought he deserved very little blame or none at all.
Teixeira adds “…The Bush administration and big insurance and pharmaceutical companies—are associated strongly with the conservatives and their policies. That should make conservatives very, very nervous.”
“Stereotype much?”
My god – you really do not get irony. No wonder you have absolutely no sense of humor.
@tena: Are you saying that Obama is a good dancer? I’m afraid I don’t understand. Wouldn’t your statement be ironic only if it was generally considered the “norm” that black people are good dancers? Wouldn’t that be stereotyping?
ChuckDenton: “Any senator from any state, regardless of population, can hold the process ‘hostage’ and I’m sure larger population senators have done it.”
True, but at least it’s from a representative of a larger portion of the total population when it happens.
It’s Obama’s white side holding him back Tena.
sbj, Tena’s point seems to be that the President defies the stereotype, regardless of whether its a load of bull or not
Lord save us from “Ego Joe,” the Moaning Scrotum.
Truly hilarious clip of Droopy Dog Lieberman here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlUx4VR4Gdo&feature=related
omg! I just said white people can’t dance. Burn me at the stake for saying the obvious!
Imsinca – Dayum! You’re just full of good news! LOL!
You know, Americans are not as dumb as so many people seem to think we are. We get it.
OT
“The European Court of Human Rights has ruled against the use of crucifixes in classrooms in Italy.
It said the practice violated the right of parents to educate their children as they saw fit, and ran counter to the child’s right to freedom of religion.
The case was brought by an Italian mother, Soile Lautsi, who wants to give her children a secular education.
But the ruling has sparked anger in the largely Catholic country, with one politician calling the move “shameful”.
The Strasbourg court found that: “The compulsory display of a symbol of a given confession in premises used by the public authorities… restricted the right of parents to educate their children in conformity with their convictions.”
It also restricted the “right of children to believe or not to believe”, the seven judges ruling on the case said in a statement quoted by AFP news agency.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/europe/8340411.stm
Love it. Class rooms aren’t the place to shove the religious dogma down the collective students’ throats.
Please ignore the troll and his dancing questions. Please continue the good, troll-free discussion ya’ll were having about substantive issues! Ignore the troll!
“Tena’s point seems to be that the President defies the stereotype.”
Let’s hope that was her point. After her remarks about Malkin…
“It’s Obama’s white side holding him back Tena”
LOL!
Well duh! hahahahahahaha – thanks for that.
LMAO @ mike in arlington
It’s always the white man holding us back.
“omg! I just said white people can’t dance. Burn me at the stake for saying the obvious!”
So your point is that it is okay to stereotype? Because your statement is demonstrably false.
chuck – The bitter pill is that this corrupt senator is not even representing the wish of majority of his own state voters.
There’s a subgenus of trollus pilisplitticus known as sacrafeminina, or: ChurchLady trollus pilisplitticus.
Also familiary known as: tiresome&humorless trollus pilisplitticus.
I’m with Ethan. Ignore the dishonest troll.
“Love it. Class rooms aren’t the place to shove the religious dogma down the collective students’ throats.”
Yeah, it only took Italy and the rest of Europe several hundred years to work that out, finally.
Which is exactly why the separation of church and state was put in the constitution – to avoid several hundred years of bloody damn wars over religion.
Humans are awfully stubborn – we seem to be determined to learn everything the hard way. I think this is the universe for slow learners and I hope next time I wind up in the regular classroom universe.
sbj – nitpicker in chief
Seriously man. You need to lighten up a little. This whole crusade of yours to divide Democrats is turning you into an uptight sour puss.
No Tena. Most of the eurpean nations do keep politics and state separate (unlike US of present days). I guess Italy & Spain are the black sheep because of their proximity to vatican.
Sorry if you think I am tiresome, mike. My domestic partner is black and I don’t think that stereotypes should be propagated. I don’t think they server any of us well. Just my opinion – didn’t intend to rile y’all up into a defense of tena’s “sense of humor.”
Tena
I’m searching for good news all day, it’s been a year since we all breathed a huge collective sigh of relief, and I want to remind everyone how lucky we are.
Here’s a little good news that slipped under the radar from that CNN poll of Obama’s approval ratings.
“Overall, 54 percent of Americans said they approved of the way Obama is handling his job, while 45 percent disapproved.
Obama received his highest marks from voters on his handling environmental policy, of the federal government’s response to swine flu, and of foreign affairs.”
Think Progress:
Despite Rhetoric About Preexisting Conditions, Boehner’s Health Care Plan Doesn’t Bar Denials
…when Boehner previewed the House Republicans’ alternative health care plan for reporters yesterday, he admitted that the GOP’s proposal “will not prevent insurance providers from barring clients based on preexisting conditions.” “We do encourage more states to have high-risk pools,” said Boehner, which he called “a place where people with preexisting conditions will have an opportunity to get affordable health insurance.”
Roll Call points out, however, that “most states have such pools, but they often are much more expensive than regular insurance and have had only limited success in reducing the ranks of the uninsured.”
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/11/03/boehner-preexisting-conditions/
Pathetic. More info/links at that post…
“No Tena. Most of the eurpean nations do keep politics and state separate (unlike US of present days). I guess Italy & Spain are the black sheep because of their proximity to vatican.”
I know they do now and it’s through bitter lessons learned from decades of bloody religious wars. The Vatican is in Italy, alright, but attendance at mass has dwindled to almost nothing – it’s mainly old women and those in orders.
So I’m not sure where we disagree.
“of the federal government’s response to swine flu,”
LOL!
I think it may possibly be evil to try to convince people that there isn’t a swine flu epidemic, as Rush is doing, just for political reasons.
It’s risible that the right is trying to use the flu as a political weapon, in the first place. But it stops being funny when someone like Rush is telling people who believe his snorts and oinks that they should ignore the swine flu outbreak.
Seriously – that just really is skirting the ragged edge of evil.
“it’s been a year since we all breathed a huge collective sigh of relief, and I want to remind everyone how lucky we are.”
I am reminded every morning when I wake up and there isn’t this leaden cloud of dread hanging over me.
amk-
Oh, I know it. I wasn’t really tryin got pick on you-just the “small state’ meme. Oh, Holy Joe seems to represent the insurance industry *just fine*.