New Ad Targets Palin’s Facebook Supporters, Tells Them She’s A Liar
Hard to say if this’ll work, but nothing else has killed the death panel lie, so why not try this?
Americans United For Change, the labor-backed White House ally, is attempting a new one: Running an ad on Facebook — one directly targeted to Sarah Palin’s hundreds of thousands of Facebook supporters — telling them Palin has been lying to them.
Starting today, thanks to the wonders of the Internets, hundreds of thousands of Palin supporters will see this image on whatever Facebook page they visit (click to enlarge):
“Send Sarah Palin a message,” the ad says, “tell her to stop lying about `death panels.’” Click through and you get an Americans United For Change page that lists non-partisan debunkings of the death panels and offers a petition that asks her to “please stop lying.”
It seems unlikely that supporters would accuse her of lying. But AUC officials say the ad’s premise is that some of her supporters are not of the hard core fringe and might at least be open to hearing death panel counterarguments. Indeed, the Facebook ad will be further targeted towards Independent and moderate Palin backers.
Palin’s Facebook presence is her whole political operation, the stage from which she’s issued her “death panel” proclamations. The idea is to undermine her on her only platform.
*****************************************
Update: Americans United For Change spokesman Jeremy Funk sends over this explanation of the new initiative:
“To make sure a weed doesn’t come back, you pull it up by its roots. The roots of right-wing hysteria over the “death panels” fantasy can be traced to former Governor turned tweeter Sarah Palin’s Facebook page, and so it only makes sense to start there in spreading the reality that the charge is devoid of any semblance of truth according to every independent fact checker that’s looked at this.”
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Actually, the polling I have seen about death panels is that people do NOT believe do not believe that the government is out to “kill grandma”. However, the claim is sensational and believed by the small right wing minority of crazytown and so it is bandied about by those seeking to firm up their conservative credentials. Keep in mind that this minority is the same people who believe Obama is not a citizen, that the Nazi’s were liberals, and that health care reform is the same thing as trying to institute death camps. They get a lot of play in the media, that doesn’t mean that rational (aka, most) people believe them.
There’s a rather famous old bit of time-lapse film which shows maggots moving through a small dead animal. Their motion sped up, you can see that though the creatures are each individuals and move independently, there is also a clear swarming or group characteristic in their motion. It’s not difficult to see parallels with how humans operate in community.
Any opportunity to push back against purposeful attempts to create or manipulate consensus ought to be utilized, if you get my drift.
What sucks, of course, is that for her most ardent fans people proving that she is lying will only make them love her more.
I agree SG. The best we can do regarding SP is to ignore her.
Which doesn’t mean that calling her out on her compulsive lying is necessarily a bad thing.
(Every little chip helps as far as I’m concerned.)
Worth a shot, but anything that draws attention to her is usually a waste of time. The only thing Sarah Palin has ever done for me is made me like Hillary Clinton that much more.
I predict that we will be overrun by Palintards as soon as this post hits memeorandum
I could pretend to be a Palintard and y’all could throw your lava lamps at me.
And here is why I think “socialized medicine” is coming to the USA whether the conservatives like it or not:
We can deal with this now, or we will deal with it more painfully later.
Not that Lieberman cares, mind you……
“I can fear monger Death Panels from here.” Granny Palin
“We can deal with this now, or we will deal with it more painfully later.”
We’re dealing with it now. I don’t think all this has been for nothing.
Neil Cavuto basically says Obama’s moral obligation should be protecting America’s wealth, not the health of all Americans.
These people are unbelievable.
http://progressnotcongress.org/?p=2640
Keeping an eye on all things Palin is going to be a lesson in modern political marketing techniques. How to promote a Lada as a Mercedes, is the problem. But they are going for it, carefully and with a clearly worked-out strategy. Entirely cynical and hugely irresponsible? Yup.
Really, this will be a perfect study in how propaganda gets done in a relatively sophisticated and relatively democratic state. And do not underestimate how good these people are at it.
These people are unbelievable.
The right has a very particular understanding of what constitutes promoting the general welfare.
And this?
He [Obama] has a moral obligation to protect our financial dignity. He has a moral obligation to protect our currency and our system. He has a moral obligation to protect our financial way of life.
This was hardly something they worried about when Shrub was president, was it?
do not underestimate how good these people are at it
They’ve been honing their craft since McCarthy.
“He has a moral obligation to protect our financial way of life.”
Now that has to be the silliest thing anyone ever wrote. Show me where in the constitution it says that the president has a moral obligation to protect our pocketbooks. Jeeeezuz!
Side note on propaganda and the value of not having your employees as part of any damned union…
“AHIP, the lobbying juggernaut representing the industry, says 50,000 employees have been engaged in writing letters and making phone calls to politicians or attending town hall meetings.”
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/08/24/ahip-townhall-lobby/
“how dare you libtards call St. Sarah a liar. she’s got more of real America in her little finger than Barry has in his teleprompter and she didn’t use ACORN to steal an election either!”
there, I’ve condensed their can of nutty soup into a tasty morsel.
Tena: idiots will be idiots. Trouble is: why are so many other idiots on board? These people who make under $100,000 will fight for CEO’s who make 20 mill a year. Think about it.
Show me where in the constitution it says that the president has a moral obligation to protect our pocketbooks.
A libertarian will point out to you that to at least some of the signers of the Declaration of Independence the preservation of property was a central part of the rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If I recall correctly Sam Adams was one of those signers.
Again, off topic but I have to zip away this morning…
Why is Latvia important?
In one way, because of the thirty “western” countries, it is the only one which has worse infant mortality rates than the US.
http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/2008/r081015.htm
h/t Balloon Juice
oddjob – True, but I would counter that with all the eminent domain caaes that have pretty much negated that notion.
The fact is that the president has no moral obligation to provide universal health care, either. We have the moral obligation to each other as a society to do that.
So where are the facts, that’s just an assertion, the Facebook posts were full of links to sources. Nice try, Greg, like that ‘illegal CIA operation’. Whatever became
of that.
Does anyone understand one thing ian cormac just posted? Cause I sure don’t.
The truth or fiction of death panels only matters to those who support the HCR bill. To everyone else it’s just another narrative.
Therefore it no longer matters whether the death panel trope is truth or fiction. It’s now entered the popular imagination as a powerfully simple image that everyone can grasp and the opposition can rally around. You know, like Bush Lied, People Died.
You cannot fight a seductive cultural meme by reinforcing the meme through repetition even with a negative spin, especially if you are a grimly serious state apparatus on the attack against a ditzy woman with big hair operating out of her Facebook page. My God, how out of touch with the ‘hood is that. So she lied? Does the White House really want to start high and mighty conversation about recent political prevarication? Now?
It’s time the various Dem politic machines start behaving like they represent the august power of the White House, rather than some clowns at Camp Sheehan in Texas circa 2005.
Never let the opposition chose the topic for public debate. The joke is on the White House. Sarah Palin, the most ordinarily dumb housewife in the country has got the most brilliant White House team (since the Bay of Pigs) all wee weeded up and pounding the media to her talking points.
By definition, every argument has a counter argument. And there do exist arguments that socialized medicine does end up rationing services based on all sorts of priorities that you don’t want to hear.
Are the supporters of the HCR bill prepared for a robust debate on the rationing of medicine? Don’t go there.
Change the topic.
Not surprising that would misunderstand that spam, which is what the AUC is posting, is a substitute for any kind of challenge, It’s like the argument clinic. Why does Kurtz’s piece not post the text of section 1233, in HR 3200, and put it in context
The AUC have put it in context. They say that Sarah Palin’s is lying about “death Panels”
How come you did not demand that she put up the documentation that would prove her claim.
Granny Palin claimed that there will be death panels, that will kill grannies(which would include her), and kill her baby.
How come you never demanded that she provide proof, to back up her Half-Baked Alaskan rants?
Monty Python, really has become a handbook for understanding
this administration, and it’s supporters. It’s not an argument, it’s a talking point.
lol labor backed! Har Har little ole Palin has the dems chasing their tails again and have called out the union thugs once again! har har har the liars telling others to stop lying while this blog whines and crys about Palin!! har har
Americans United For Change, the labor-backed White House ally
Are the supporters of the HCR bill prepared for a robust debate on the rationing of medicine?
—-
No they are not and will not. All they want to discuss is boohoo Palin is lying. Boohoo the evil republicans, boohoo we can’t rahm our entitlement programs down the throats of Americans how dare they speak up! Don’t they realize only the government can run their life. boohoo evil bush boohoo evil republicans boohoo evil palin.
nope not a chance they would dare discuss the context of the bill that was written by the Apollo Alliance, most probably have not even read the damn bill let alone be honest about what is in HR3200.
Open your ears libbies America is sick of your lies, tatics and taking of our money! You will be gone 2010 and might not ever make it back so pay attention!
Republican Senator, Chuck Grassley, said yesterday, on National TV, that the Death Panel Claims are false, and that they are not in the proposed House bill.
Ergo: Senator Chuck Grassley has just called Granny Palin A Liar!!!!
Dear Anonymous, I have read section 1233, and have looked at the Social Security Act referenced, and as a lawyer I have to say, it is as clear as mud whether these end-of-life consultations will end up being deployed as mandatory. Laws do not appear in a void; they have a context of implementation. That is why it is always imperative to see how similar legislation has played out in the round. There is simply no way to know for certain based on language alone. The “voluntariness” of any given provision may prove illusory as it transitions from words on paper to a living reality in practice.
For example, Illinois’ Department of Family and Child Services is notorious for taking voluntary provisions and transforming them to have coercive effect, in clear violation of the spirit, if not the letter, of the law. A child’s placement into foster care is theoretically “voluntary,” but if the suspect parents do not cooperate, neglect proceeding will ensue. The choice becomes illusory, especially for the weak and defenseless.
As another example, in the Netherlands an abstract, government-granted “right” of self-termination has become progressively more coercive over time, as the culture transforms from one where euthanasia moved from exception to cultural norm. Once such a practice becomes part of the culture, it becomes very difficult to displace, and much more difficult for the unwilling to resist.
Think about it this way. Clever social programmers are not unlike clever computer programmers. They have a comprehensive grasp of how all the layers of a system interact in real life and over time. It is not always desirable to program for a direct effect, especially if there is a defense the system you are trying to circumvent. If you are a virus writer, you want to lay down code primitives that appear relatively innocuous to those defense systems, but which, when taken up in a later context, will assemble to code that harms the system.
So yes, we do have direct laws inhibiting the practice of euthanasia. So? If you believe in euthanasia, as is the case with Zeke Emanuel et al, then you code around those laws using no direct assault. You set up an incentive system, i.e., reimbursement for end-of-life counseling, to work in passive conjunction with star chamber shadow figures rationing treatment based on “complete lives” efficiency models, with the effect that government doctors are motivated to push weakened patients into planning for crossing that board-certified efficiency threshold, where the cost of sustaining their life will outweigh the relative value of their life. Nietzsche would be so proud.
Furthermore, failure to provide such consultation could result in patient’s families suing doctors for not preparing grandma and grandma’s family for the trauma of the plug pulling-ceremony. Doing these consultations would become the new standard of care, thus a necessary defense against malpractice, and doctors would become reluctant to continue with patients who were not cooperative in protecting the doctor from liability. Which is, perhaps, why tort reform is not part of this package. The clever coders have need of the incentive of fear of litigation to keep doctors motivated to act defensively and therefore very predictably. Extortion works.
The absence of explicit mandatory language is therefore not dispositive proof that a statute will not be taken as a mandate. It would be somewhat better if explicit “voluntary” verbiage were added, along with disincentives to indirect coercion. However, I have recently learned that such clarifying language was offered and was solidly rejected. This betrays the hidden cards. The crafters of this bill must keep closed any exits that might derail this “virus” from reaching its true objective, which is to create an illusory choice with only one socially, medically, and economically acceptable outcome for the disfavored: Do you want your pain pill now or later.
doctorrw.blogspot.com/2009/08/hr-3200-end-of-life-counseling.html
HR 3200 end of life counseling provision: paid service or mandate?
That seems to be the question du jour concerning the health care reform bill. Although the notion (advanced by Betsy McCaughey and others) that the bill would require seniors to undergo counseling has been characterized as a wingnut lie, when I went and read the relevant section of the original bill (pages 425-430) things got really muddy. After reading and re-reading I just couldn’t be sure who’s lying, who’s telling the truth and who’s just plain confused. I’m nowhere near as smart as some folks on both sides of the issue who seem so sure so I thought I’d ask Fred Thompson. After all he’s a former senator and a lawyer, and McCaughey made the claim on his show. I wrote to him, in part, concerning the bill:
The language is arcane. It amends and makes reference to portions of the Social Security act which I was unable to access. That said, to my reading it merely adds such counseling as a covered service but does not mandate it. Do you really believe it will force elders to engage in such counseling? Alternatively, is the language so vague that we really can’t anticipate how it will be interpreted? I would appreciate it if you would help me and some of my blogging colleagues work through the legalese. Thanks!
In the meantime, while I waited for Fred’s reply (and I’m still waiting) a commenter tipped me off to these posts by Wesley Smith at Secondhand Smoke. Concerning McCaughey’s claim he wrote:
Is she right? It is very hard to tell. That section of the bill refers to existing law without quoting it.
And, a little further on:
Here’s the thing: I’m a lawyer and I couldn’t figure out what this section of the bill would actually require because it refers to existing laws, and to look up and cross reference those against the bill would require hours to figure out. That in itself should send up warning flares. From what I have seen, this bill is simply incomprehensible.
It is urgent that our representatives slow down, figure out what these bills really contain, and let the people weigh in before the legislation is finally decided upon. That the President of the United States, the Speaker of the House of Representatives and others in political leadership want to deny us that opportunity tells me this bill is toxic–and on that basis alone, it should be rejected unless sufficient time is allowed to permit the democratic process to operate in a proper fashion.
So Smith, a lawyer and an expert in bioethics no less, shares my confusion! At the very least we need time for the representatives and the American public, particularly seniors, to understand the provision. Maybe, as Smith suggests, the language of the bill needs some tweaks to make it abundantly clear that the counseling would be voluntary and without coercion:
Regardless, if mandatory counseling is not what the president and Congress really have in mind, it would be very easy to correct any confusion:
1. Add a provision stating that the counseling is entirely voluntary–both for the patient and the medical provider. In that way, the regulations–that will be thousands of more pages–promulgated by the agencies to further the purpose of the law won’t be able to require counseling.
2. Add a provision stating that the patient will not lose benefits if he/she refuses counseling or does not sign an advance directive.
3. Add a provision that no service provider will lose compensation for not providing counseling.
4. Add a provision prohibiting the counseling from being directed toward refusing or accepting care–along the same lines of the Kennedy/Brownback bill passed last year to prevent genetic counseling of pregnant women carrying a Down baby from being directed toward abortion.
All the ambiguity aside Smith did cite some concerning language in the provision (italics added):
Such consultation shall include the following:
and—
The Secretary shall limit the requirement for explanations under clause…
OK, maybe the imperative words here merely refer to coding requirements in order to get reimbursed for the counseling, but who knows?
I’m reading cocksure opinions, from folks on both sides of this debate, not wingnut lies. It’s refreshing to see a nuanced analysis such as Smith’s, and I hope he stays on top of the issue.
Posted by R. W. Donnell at 3:53 PM
doctorrw.blogspot.com/2009/08/hr-3200-end-of-life-counseling.html
Insurance companies have been spending over a million a day (probably a lot more) trying to fill town hall meetings with lying protesters, spreading rumors, and pulling any trick they can muster.
BY THE WAY — THIS IS BAD FAITH — and should be investigated. If true — every insurance company committing this FRAUD should risk losing their license.
But, do you blame them for taking a 20% (cost and overhead) cut off $2,400,000,000,000? Well, yes I do, because they provide 37th in quality care, drop people for costs, exclude pre-existing conditions, and encourage bad medicine and discourage preventative health.
They are a disease and they need to be shut down.
I say, prosecute each of them for bad faith. They are NOT allowed to commit FRAUD…. Haven’t they learned that yet?
LOL more whinning instead of actual substance!
hey newsflash acorn, seiu, CFA, soro’s are all pumping $$ and people into town hall guess that is ok with you?? also all the corruption and fraud by the government is ok with you?
who am I???
“Unlike allocation by *** or race, allocation by age is not invidious discrimination; every person lives through different life stages rather than being a single age. Even if 25-year-olds receive priority over 65-year-olds, everyone who is 65 years now was previously 25 years.”
“services provided to individuals who are irreversibly prevented from being or becoming participating citizens are not basic and should not be guaranteed.”
(hey that line gets rid of most of the entitlement programs oh wait that’s not the goal!!)
‘Vague promises of savings from cutting waste, enhancing prevention and wellness, installing electronic medical records and improving quality are merely lipstick cost controls, more for show and public relations than for true change.”
Now who am I??
“Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society.”
“A program of sterilizing women after their second or third child, despite the relatively greater difficulty of the operation than vasectomy, might be easier to implement than trying to sterilize men,”
The development of a long-term sterilizing capsule that could be implanted under the skin and removed when pregnancy is desired opens additional possibilities for coercive fertility control.”
“Adding a sterilant to drinking water or staple foods.” After noting that, well, yes, there were “very difficult political, legal and social questions, to say nothing of the technical problems,”
“To be acceptable, such a substance would have to meet some rather stiff requirements,”
“It must be uniformly effective, despite widely varying doses received by individuals, and despite varying degrees of fertility and sensitivity among individuals; it must be free of dangerous or unpleasant side effects; and it must have no effect on members of the opposite ***, children, old people, pets or livestock.”
No one wants America to become a socialist country. Really! Do you have medicare, medicaid? a socialist programs. Do you have social security? a socialist program. Do your children go to a public school? socialist education. The one main thing that Europeans understand, that unfortunately the majority of Americans do not, is that caring about your fellow man is the right and decent thing to do, and if that means paying a little more to ensure that EVERYONE has health care, then they are happy to do it. We are not the United States of America, we are the divided States of America. If we would only work together for the benefit of ALL, it would be amazing to see what we could accomplish. The only thing I see Republicans doing is devoting all of their time and energies in defeating Obama, rather than working with him to improve the lot of every American. We are the laughing stock of the worl, and rightly so.
He asked sleepy Fred Thompson for to provide clarity. The same Fred Thompson who was going to rescue their party last year. LMAO
What is it with Republicans. They are always bashing Democrats for having Hollywood connections, but it is actually Republicans who keep nominating and electing Hollywood types.
liam the racists granny hater, did you notice that Fred’s answer is not in what I posted, oh sure you didn’t if you had you would have responded to what was address concerning HR 3200 instead of your typical I hate republican response.
So Liam the racists granny hatter do you have any comments on the actual text of what I posted or just the same old cow poop you spew all day long?
LOL Betty maybe Europe would suit your fancy better than America! All those programs are FAILURES we are FORCED to pay into, just like all socialism.
I’ll take my social security and medicare $$ back and put them to better use then the government and I certainly can educate my children better than the American Public School system that has been hijacked by the union and liberal kooks!
Republicans bash Hollywood Democrats, but it is Republicans who elected the vast majority of actors as US Senators, Congress Reps, and Governors.
Since she no longer holds public office, and since she is a Grandmother, I feel it is only proper and respectful to refer to her as Granny Palin. I am sure that is how her grand child will address her.
I think it is disgusting how all you right wingers, especially those of you who claim to be born again, are constantly indulging in lascivious fantasy over the former Governor. Show some respect, for heaven’s sake. After all you are lusting after some one’s Granny.
Mind you, I do not hold you fully responsible for that, because it was all those Conservative Columnists who first started lusting after her, after they had visited her in Alaska.
Demonize…It’s all you Socialists got at this point.
She only said it AS A ******* METAPHOR ONCE!
THEN CLARIFIED IT WITH ANOTHER POST.
YOU COMMUNIST ***** ARE THE LIARS.
I can demonize too:)
**** you!
LOL!!! Sarah scares the Hell out of people. Her common sense approach leaves them with no where to go except into the gutter.
Once you support Sarah Palin, you never change your mind. Especially when its a leftist organization attacking her. So be sure to let them all know major FAIL on their part. You havent figured it out yet. You probably never will. Go ahead lets see just how many supporters,decide to withdrawl their support from her facebook page. Be sure to keep count. I have a question-since Palin has no office and is not an elected official, what are you all scared of? That people may trust her enough to listen to her. Well that means you all need to present better ideas, not attack ads.
This truly shows how stupid the democrat/communists are!
Of course,we have stupid RINOs to deal with as well.
For one thing, the “death panel” was a metaphor as Betchoazz so artfully explained. It had NOTHING to do with the end of life counseling.
The “death panels” are those who will ration care. The bean counters who will demand budget cuts. The “death panels” are those like Dr. Zeke Emanuel(Rahm’s friggin’ brother) who have written on many occasions that both young children and granny are not worth as much to society as those in their 20s through early 50s, thus not deserving the same care. Dr Joseph Mengele would be proud of this son-of-a-*****! And so would his boss, Adolf!
Everyone in the country, except the criminally stupid understood EXACTLY what Sarah Palin meant when she discussed “death panels.”
THAT is what has the left all wee-wee’ed up! (goddamn Obama really is a moron, huh?) Sarah Palin, with a couple of posts on Facebook has once again kicked Obama in the nuts!
She is on this losers brain. he can’t stop talking about her. She OWNS this little communist Chicago street thug!
Obama sent his attack machine to Alaska to give her hell, and she side stepped that by turning the reigns over to Sean Parnell, a brilliant move.
For you idiots that don’t know anything about Sarah, except what you see on SNL, let me clue you in:
Before she was Governor, Sarah Palin was Chairman of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, the agency that controls oil and natural gas production in Alaska (as well as coal and other resources)
This is a very powerful job.
Once running the show, Sarah realized her agency was full of corrupt Republicans, including much of the Republican party leadership that just happened to work for her. Now the Governor, a Republican, wouldn’t let her clean this mess up. And under Frank Murkoski, the Governor, Alaska politics was almost as filthy as Chicago thug politics.
Sarah “quit” that job too.
Sarah then made it her full time job to take down the entire corrupt Republican party, including the Governor, which she did. Some are STILL sitting in prison.
Well, since Obama decided he wanted to screw with her and her beloved state of Alaska, by having his Alaska Mafia file bogus ethics charges and cost the state millions, he has pissed off a human buzz saw.
Palin has cleared her desk of all other business, and will spend the next 3 years being this idiot Obama’s worst nightmare!
She took down the entire Republican party, and a strong Republican Governor in Alaska. Destroying this weak *** Obama and his band of idiots will be like child’s play for her.
Hell, she’s beating him in her bathrobe, from Facebook!! And Obama has the entire media, and complete and total control of Congress, and he STILL isn’t as strong as she is!
This really isn’t even fair, Palin is much too smart for Obama, he is so outclassed by her.
I can’t wait for his union thugs to attack Sarah though. It will be fun to remind America that Hitler used the union thugs against everyday Germans, as well.
And since attacking people like Rush Limbaugh only made him more prominent, and actually GREW his ranks of over 20 million listeners, I am pretty sure these thugs attacking America’s Governor, or as Tammy Bruce calls her, the 101st Senator, I’m sure this will backfire spectacularly, as well.
If the democrat/communist party actually had ideas, and solutions, instead of lies and stupidity, they wouldn’t be loosing every argument.
Democrat/communist= Epic Fail!
SP is the pig with lipstick on…..enuf said! People are so earger to hate that they’d believe Hitler if he were alive today (and we all know he was satin in disguise). Why not have another option for health, if YOU dont waant it then dont take it–but dont stop others from having the freedom of choice. We’re still paying for the healthcare, but at the end. Many of these people, if they had proper healthcare, would and could work and contribute by paying taxes and so forth. I personally think it would be cheaper for preventative (i.e. routine doctor visits), so that the issues/illnesses dont progress to a place where the resolution is quadruple the costs. HHHEEELLLOOO PEOPLE….we’re still paying for this. I agree with someone earlier who said: “take the pill now or later”…GET IT????
“To make sure a weed doesn’t come back, you pull it up by its roots”
Farmer Funk is living in the wrong country in the wrong age with the wrong paradigm. Give him a glass of glycophosphate.
Sure, he woulda made a loyal thick-necked Stalinist apparatchik. In fact, Stalin actually talked about weeding his garden when he ordered people deposed too. Ah, the good old days, when unofficial dialectics could be yanked from the soil of political discourse like so many weeds.
But we ain’t in the USSR circa 1934. So how do such ahistorical, pre-information age nit-wits become spokesidiots for a “White House Ally?”
Here’s a clue for the AUC. Never strike an aggressively authoritarian, seek-and-destroy pose when attacking those who dissent from the President of the United States, the most powerful man in the world. It makes him, by association, appear simultaneously weak, cowardly and brutish.
“the “death panels” fantasy can be traced to former Governor turned tweeter Sarah Palin’s Facebook page.”
That’s some pretty clever police work there, Gestapo. So have her arrested! My God, it is so embarrassing to have a “White House ally” become hysterically paranoid over a woman’s tweetering! It’s the stuff of late night comedy. You’d think Palin was Aung San Suu Kyi.
“it only makes sense to start there in spreading the reality…”
Stop right there! Because that’s exactly what the AUC will end up doing.
The AUC is helping spread the reality of the visually viral image of Death Panels deeper into the very fabric of the national debate. Why is it so hard to grasp that the Death Panel’s propaganda value is independent of its veracity?? Simply to engage the issue is a major victory for HCR opponents.
AUC might as well be working for Sarah Palin. With friends like the AUC who needs enemies?
Well, I just worked (and I do mean WORKED) my way through the post by gary … and it’s a good illustration of how thoroughly spellbound the Palinbots are. There is not much point in talking to them rationally..
He says “Before she was Governor, Sarah Palin was Chairman of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, the agency that controls oil and natural gas production in Alaska (as well as coal and other resources)
This is a very powerful job.
Once running the show, Sarah realized her agency was full of corrupt Republicans, including much of the Republican party leadership that just happened to work for her. Now the Governor, a Republican, wouldn’t let her clean this mess up. And under Frank Murkoski, the Governor, Alaska politics was almost as filthy as Chicago thug politics.” HMMMMM sure gary and as you said, she QUIT that job …
So, she couldn’t handle the job, she quit …. what makes these Palinbots think she could ‘handle the job’ of President then?
I have been reading Palinbot posts on her FB site … actually respond in PM to some of them .. they are totally deluded.
Since no ‘disagreement’ is allowed there, I have started a blog and plan to c&p a few of the nuttier ones, and responding there.
Keep up the good work! It’s tiring isn’t it, swatting away at these gnats!
gary also says: “For one thing, the “death panel” was a metaphor as Betchoazz so artfully explained. It had NOTHING to do with the end of life counseling.
The “death panels” are those who will ration care. The bean counters who will demand budget cuts. The “death panels” are those like Dr. Zeke Emanuel(Rahm’s friggin’ brother) who have written on many occasions that both young children and granny are not worth as much to society as those in their 20s through early 50s, thus not deserving the same care. Dr Joseph Mengele would be proud of this son-of-a-*****! And so would his boss, Adolf!
Everyone in the country, except the criminally stupid understood EXACTLY what Sarah Palin meant when she discussed “death panels.” ”
Well gary, then 90% of Sarah supporters on her FB page are ‘criminally stupid’ … because that’s how many bought into the so-called death panels.
“Brad Woodhouse former President of Americans United for Change, is now communications director for the Democratic National Committee under Barack Obama.”
From wikipedia
This is just a front organization for the DNC and its political supporters.
Paul … sweetie … who do YOU think should be communications director for the DNC …. Newt Gingrich???
How dumb can you be .. OF COURSE an Obama supporter is part of the DNC … do you think the RNC has a Democrat for THEIR communications director?
What are you, some sort of dumb Sherlock Holmes of politics?
Sara is your worst nightmare. She is out there and coming to get you lowlife libs. Get a life and worry about that dip S$#t Obama
FKR
USMC
GO SARAH !!!
Did any of you democRATS even read her facebook posts?I guess you all are to busy searching the internet for fishy comments to snitch for a better nose position up the WHs as@!I guess your still looking at your iou wondering when your bankrupt state will say its ok to cash it.If you lived in her state it would cash cause she saved billions in good times for tough times like right now.Or maybe your thinking how great it is to pay huge tax rates,oh ya did I tell you her states tax rates are Americas lowest?Or maybe your just jumping for joy you get to wait in a huge unemployment lineup in your state with double didget unemployment.Oh ya her states is at 7% right now.You all sound so smart with your stupidity I cant believe your alive.I guess you just love medicare backlogs,oh did you know she reduced her states by 83%.You must really enjoy earmarks you know swamp mice studies,did you know she reduced her states earmarks by 85%?Well get ready for another lineup since you just love waiting for everything.Get ready for rationing,since you just love rationing.Get ready because you wont have to watch a beauracrat unplug grannie because he wont let her get plugged in to start with.I guess you will like that because you wont have to wait as long for your inheritence.Oh ya and lastly did you read about the trillions in new tax revenues and economic activity she spoke about.Ya instead of giving loans to finance Soros invested Brazilian oil companys you could drill off your own states shores,or in your own states soil and actually have trillions of dollars.You people are pathetic go stare at your iou and think about it.
In her facebook post, she quoted the house bill. Wow, such liar for daring to quote the legislation on the table? And then the Senate removes it from their working draft, because it was too ambiguous and maybe seemed scary to some people. (like Sarah.) Try reading the bill, fellow americans. SP has.
Sarah was not making anything up, fools.
The poster before me makes a great point. Sarah not only takes the least from her state’s citizens, of any governor, but she sends checks back to them to split the state oil profits, with every tax payer in the state.
Maybe if Obama or McCain had actually been a state governor, we could compare them as executives. Alas, those two have not comparable experience.. although, now, 8 months in as president, with the highest negatives of any American president, I think Obama is experiencing fast.. right about now.
If you click on the ad, do these union weasels have to pay extra? I can click on ‘em all day if so!
Facts: Convention speech audience as high as Obama–Every magazine she appears in sells highest # of issues–She draws 20,000 to a parade in NY town of 26,000–Her Facebook page grows by 200,000 AFTER she resigns–Her Facebook entries and her Wash. Post op-ed from July 14 have all but defeated Obama’s cap and tax and health care proposals…singlehandedly–Her memoir will be an instant #1 and sell millions–Most Republicans voted for HER, NOT McCain last year–The more she’s attacked, the more she’s loved–She’s just getting started–The dem/libs are running for cover…from Sarah Palin, the 45th President of the United States….Eat THEM apples…and choke on them!!!
Palin’s supporters probably don’t even care about the truth. They like it when she lies. The only thing in front of a death panel in these people’s lives is reality.
“The poster before me makes a great point. Sarah not only takes the least from her state’s citizens, of any governor, but she sends checks back to them to split the state oil profits, with every tax payer in the state.”
1. She quit, so why the present tense?
2. Apparently, if her rehetoric’s to be believed, she’d also strip people of Medicare if she had her way, because it would “lead to socialism”: http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2008/10/palin_medicare_leads_to_totalitarianism.php
3. Talk to Alaskans about the legacy she left up there:
“The situation is so bad the federal government has forbidden the state to sign up new people until the state makes necessary improvements. [snip]
The moratorium is expected to last four or five months. State officials estimate about 1,000 Alaskans will be affected.
A particularly alarming finding concerns deaths of adults in the programs. In one 2 1/2 year stretch, 227 adults already getting services died while waiting for a nurse to reassess their needs. Another 27 died waiting for their initial assessment, to see if they qualified for help.
No other state in the nation is under such a moratorium, according to a spokeswoman for the federal Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services.
A particularly alarming finding concerns deaths of adults in the programs. In one 2 1/2 year stretch, 227 adults already getting services died while waiting for a nurse to reassess their needs. Another 27 died waiting for their initial assessment, to see if they qualified for help.”
“Doctors and other health care providers wrote to the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid with concerns that the state wasn’t responsive. Some alleged that the lack of state controls “has resulted in the death(s) of the active clients,” the federal review said.
While the people served are frail and suffer from chronic health issues, the state never investigated to determine if any failure in service contributed to the deaths, the federal review found.
‘Thus, if someone passed away because a (personal care assistant) did not show up, for example, there was no indication this would have been reported or investigated,’ the report said.
The state plans to start doing fatality reviews.”
http://www.adn.com/life/health/story/864670.html
Those are FACTS!
The truth hurts…liberals.
1) FACT: When health care becomes “free” (i.e. someone else is paying for it), fewer people will take the “wait and see” approach and immediately seek care.
2) FACT: The system will be flooded with abuse. This, coupled with 1) above, will mean more and more money will be required as more and more people see doctors whether they need to or not.
3) FACT: Multi-layered government beaurocracy means unchecked waste and less efficient use of health care funds.
4) FACT: The combined effect of 1), 2), and 3) mean that there will be less money to pay for greater doctor and hospital visits.
5) FACT: 4) will necessitate rationing of health care.
6) FACT: It will be a government panel, or government appointed panel, who will decide what medical procedures are necessary.
7) FACT: The only way the health care system will be able to sustain itself is to cut off people who need expensive, long-term care but aren’t considered “productive members of society”, i.e., screw the elderly, terminally ill, and the mentally handicapped.
Palin was telling the truth, libtards. Death panels already exist, and will soon expand to cover the entire nation if we accept the plan Congress it trying to force on us but exempt themselves from (and doesn’t that tell you ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW about how worthless the plan is? The authors of the plan don’t even want it!).
I think you’ll find those are all predictions or opinions. Look up “fact” in a dictionary.
The truth has a liberal bias
1) SPECULATION: When health care becomes “free” (i.e. someone else is paying for it), fewer people will take the “wait and see” approach and immediately seek care.
FACT: Many people delay seeking care already because they can’t afford it, even though there is something seriously wrong. I was one of those people five years ago and it nearly resulted in my death…at age 38.
2) SPECULATION: The system will be flooded with abuse. This, coupled with 1) above, will mean more and more money will be required as more and more people see doctors whether they need to or not.
The system is already flooded with abuse, from the top down. Insurance companies deny coverage based on “pre-existing conditions” (something as trivial as a broken bone during childhood), resulting in the patient delaying care (see FACT 1 above), which in turn results in higher costs for compounding problems. As the patient usually cannot afford the necessary treatment to save their lives, they must utilize the hospitals financial aid program. Guess who absorbs these costs–EVERYONE. Guess who reaps the benefits of the resulting higher insurance premiums–the insurance companies.
3) SPECULATION: Multi-layered government beaurocracy means unchecked waste and less efficient use of health care funds.
FACT: You can’t get much less efficient than health costs rising over 200 percent in the space of 15 years, with the result being a country that ranks 37th out of 50 in life expectancy, infant mortality, and so on.
4) SPECULATION: The combined effect of 1), 2), and 3) mean that there will be less money to pay for greater doctor and hospital visits.
FACT: The combined effect of 1), 2), and 3) means that corporations earn record profits and the general public gets screwed.
5) SPECULATION: 4) will necessitate rationing of health care.
FACT: Rationing already exists on the basis of ability to pay.
6) SPECULATION: It will be a government panel, or government appointed panel, who will decide what medical procedures are necessary.
FACT: Corporate drones in cubicles now decide what medical procedures are necessary.
7) SPECULATION: The only way the health care system will be able to sustain itself is to cut off people who need expensive, long-term care but aren’t considered “productive members of society”, i.e., screw the elderly, terminally ill, and the mentally handicapped.
FACT: The only way the health care system currently sustains itself is to cut off people who need expensive, long-term care but cannot afford it and thus aren’t considered “productive members of society”, i.e., screw the elderly, terminally ill, and the mentally handicapped if it’s going to cut into corporate profits.
SPECULATION: While not called a “death panel”, such “screw the elderly” style provisions have been touted by Democrat politicians, and currently exist in veterans’ care.
FACT: While not called a “death panel”, such “screw everybody” style provisions have been touted by Republican politicians, and currently exist in veterans’ care–thanks to the Republicans who slashed funding for said veterans’ care. Remember, these are the same people who would vote (and in many cases, HAVE voted) against Medicare, Medicaid,
and increased funding for veterans’ benefits. Yes, I’m talking about you, Senator McCain, he who has received government-run health care his entire life and only has a problem with it when other people want access.
Palin is an idiot, conservatwit. Death panels DO already exist, and will soon expand to cover the entire nation if we don’t demand the plan Congress has for themselves but doesn’t want anyone else to have (and doesn’t that tell you ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW about how worthless the the Republicans and Blue Dogs are? They have inserted so many addendums and provisions that now they don’t even want it!)
The death panels are already here.They are called INSURANCE COMPANIES.They have for way too long been able to deny care for anyone who might actually use their services they had been paying for.The insurance companies are scared of losing control so instead of being honest they are getting the very people they would deny insurance to, to do their dirty work for them.The CEOs of these companies must be laughing their heads off.And the fools being used need to wake up because they or their loved ones will be the next in line to be stamped “denied”My dad was in the Air Force for 30 yrs and will be the first to admit his health care is socialistic.My husband is a disabled Vet and uses the VA hospital for his health care since being laid off from his job he held for 20 yrs.Both he and I were covered for health insurance at his job.Cobra offered to allow us to pay $1,200 a month to continue using our HMO.No way could we afford it ,so he decided to use the VA for his care, but what about me? I am 59 and now have high blood pressure and need a knee replacement.I decided to apply for their individual plan as it would cost me less a month instead of $600.00 using COBRA.I was DENIED for having a pre- existing illness.No way could we afford it.Here I am too young for medicare and not quite poor enough for medicaid.Just when I was about to give up President Obamas’ Cobra payment help came to my rescue.Yes, we could afford the reduced cost for insurance.I pray the government will pass the Health reform Bill before the Cobra help runs out.We are an average family who wants our taxes to go for US and other Americans.I don’t think that is too much to ask.
I fail to see how Palin’s popularity makes her right. Britney Spears is popular, too. It’s just shocking that people actually support this empty suit. She is a product of marketing, nothing more. To come in here and defend her shows how empty the Palinbots really are.
idiots…it is true which is WHY they removed it…but I guess all of you who are koolaid drinkers from msnbc or cnn didn’t get that memo from the white house.
FYI – TO ALL KOOL AID DRINKERS…WAKE UP
Senators Remove “Death Panel” from Health Care Deform Bill
For over a week now, the commies in Washington have been trying to convince the American public that there were no Death Panels in the Health Care Deform bill; calling Sarah Palin a liar, saying it was all a bunch of hooey sparked by those “angry, Astroturfing, Right Winger Tea Baggers,” etc.
So, I have a question: If there was no “Death Panel” provision in the Health Care Deform bill, then how can you remove that which does not exist?
Score another hit point for Sarah Palin and the Tea Party protesters!
Sounds to me like the Lame Stream Media and the Commies in Washington owe Sarah Palin and We the People a BIG FLAGGIN’ APOLOGY!!!!!
Senators exclude end-of-life provision from bill
Thu Aug 13, 1:55 pm ET – via YahooNews
WASHINGTON – Key senators are excluding a provision on end-of-life care from health overhaul legislation after language in a House bill caused a furor.
Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa, top Republican on the Senate Finance Committee, said in a statement Thursday that the provision had been dropped from consideration because it could be misinterpreted or implemented incorrectly.
A health care bill passed by three House committees allows Medicare to reimburse doctors for voluntary counseling sessions about end-of-life decisions. But critics have claimed the provision could lead to death panels and euthanasia for seniors.
The Senate Finance Committee is still working to complete a bill.
I still do not understand how someone could get “death panels”from being asked if they want information concerning end of life decisions the patients themselves would make.This option was not removed because there was ever death panels, but because some people were too stupid to know the difference.Perhaps Republicans do not want to have to think about the reality they won’t get out of this world alive.
Death Panel is a bit sensational but rationing based on “affordability” age and other factors is exactly what this plan calls for. Look no further than VA program “end of life counseling” page 21 is designed to help talk veterans into ending their life. Its in BLACK AND WHITE.
Palin was right and facts are tough to deal with for liberals
Most people do not want to be hooked up to a ventilator or tube fed for years and the only way to assure this will not happen is for patients to make their wishes known.If they don’t they will be at the mercy of some relative that just can’t let their loved one go no matter how much their loved one maybe suffering or just doesn’t want this to happen.That is what the counseling would provide for the patient:to make the patients wants to be known.Rationing is the reality NOW and it is based on if your wealthy or have great insurance you get taken care of.If you don’t well it is pretty much “too bad so sad”.Sarah Palin doesn’t live like most people.She and her family will never want for excellent health care.Conservatives have seldom been known for caring or protecting citizens .It was a liberal who was at the forefront of medicare.His name was Roosevelt.Conservatives would rather be in charge of ,who deserves in the first place, medical care so this tactic of scaring the elderly with words like “Death Panel” is unconscionable.
The counseling would also assure that some relative doesn’t”pull the plug” before the patient is ready.It would take it out of the hands of others and put it into the decision making process that patients needs to make for themselves.
i dont know why people keep insisting that palin is right. from what i have read, the part of the bill in question, the so-called ” death panel” is an extension of an already existing bill which was drafted by the bush administration. and as far as rationing care- noone rations care more than the current for- profit insurance industry. every dollar paid out for health care is a dollar that wont go into the ceo’s pockets. what better incentive to “ration” care is there? and this is not a theory. it is based in fact. over and over and over it has shown to be true. how much corruption, greed and heartless practices are people willing to excuse, deny or ignore in order to justify keeping our current system? before this new administration, anger and complaints about managed health care were common. people could not always see the dr. of their choice, or even the hospital of their choice,unless they were in the ins. co’s “network”. people were ,on avg,dissatisfied with the way ins. co’s conducted business. only now, there seems to be a real love-fest going on between those who oppose change, and their health care providers. i can understand that there are going to be those who disagree with any number of bills that are,have been, or will be drafted for health care reform. what i dont understand is the ****-slinging, the screaming, death threats, the unbelievable rudeness, out-right lies,distortions,half-truths,and etc. that have plagued this issue since it first started. insurance companies have found a way to use the very people that they have abused, to come to their(ins.co) aid when called out on their shady practices.the same people they screw, are the same people ripping to shreads anyone who dares to try and call the ins. co’s to task and force change for the better. i am talking about people who dont want any change, none. no how, no way. hell no. they have closed the door to their minds and any talk of reform is just so much “socialist” obama ****. and anyone who defends him is scum. period.they can spew out their objections with the words of an uneducated hick, or they can attempt to sound “smarter-than-thou-art, by bragging about what they know, who they know, and by the way, they are a lawyer, so who the hell are you?it doesnt change the fact that the current system is going to implode ,and all the name-calling, obama-hating reform resisters are going to be in the same boat as the un-insured,under-insured people that they dont give a damn about. the end
If people are not able to see the connect here with the “death panel”, there is a lack of common sense logic in the non-believer. Sarah Palin is correct, her wording may sound hash, but it hit the truth. What is mandated is that the Drs. do this and get paid to do this, not our of kindness or good reasoning. This will perhaps result in corruption similar to Abortion clinics, another death clinic.
OH My now they are bringing abortion clinics into the issue of asking patients if they want to make their OWN decisions concerning medical decisions!When they have nothing of substance to debate they try and switch topics.
There is no logic to their thinking.And they expect others to really pay a lot of attention to their rantings?I think not.
Paleolithic palin has to be the biggest goofball around. She states that man has never had an impact on the environment. Someone should take that clown on a plane ride over the Pacific Ocean and show her the floating garbage mass….twice the size of Texas. But then again, she can probably see it from her front porch. What a duffus.