Happy Hour Roundup
* That Bloomberg poll I noted below also has some sobering numbers for Obama showing public skepticism that he can realize his health care promises, though the public seems to support the goals themselves.
* Like me, Jason Linkins is thoroughly flummoxed by GOP Rep. Mark Kirk and his spectacular flip flop on cap and trade.
* Is Senator Jay Rockefeller, staunch defender of the public option, optimistic that Obama may still be supportive of it? Rockefeller met with Obama today, and subsequently put out a statement proclaiming, suggestively, that “he and I are united in our efforts to deliver” on the promise of “affordable and effective health care for all Americans.”
* Turns out Chuck Grassley isn’t the only GOP Senator who wants Dems to basically cede all their leverage in advance to prove their bipartisan good intentions. Mike Enzi was pretty explicit in articulating this position way back in July.
* Steve Benen says the real question to be asked about the controversy over Obama’s czars is “whether news outlets will pretend this is a legitimate story anyway, by virtue of GOP complaints.”
* Michael Goldfarb says that cap and trade is dead in the wake of this CBS News report saying the Obama administration has privately concluded the plan would gouge American taxpayers.
* Ben Smith, eternal optimist, says that not all the voters who say Obama is the anti-christ actually believe this.
* Leading liberal groups think the Max Baucus health care plan is a big old sham. ABC’s Rick Klein rounds up the reactions.
* And here’s today’s installment in the Michele Bachmann chronicles.
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More proof that Rush Limbaugh isn’t a racist and never says racist things:
“Anyway, Rush got on to his “legitimate” question. He explained how presidents are usually heavily scrutinized before being elected, and after being elected to office — they are usually given a “media anal exam.” But Rush said no scrutiny has occurred with President Obama, and when these “checks and balances are MIA,” our nation is headed for trouble.
So Rush’s question was: “Can this nation really have an African-American president?”
Tell Limd@ck to look in the oval office window to answer his own question!!
“Tthe real question to be asked about the controversy over Obama’s czars is “whether news outlets will pretend this is a legitimate story anyway, by virtue of GOP complaints.”
Hm. Guess someone didn’t get the message:
“A liberal senator on Wednesday questioned President Barack Obama’s policy “czars” after the senior advisers have taken heat mostly from Republican lawmakers.
Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wis.) sent a letter to the president requesting the White House release information regarding the “roles and responsibilities” of the “czars.” The Senate Judiciary Committee member also requested that the president’s legal advisers prepare a “judgment” on the “czars’” constitutionality.”
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/59071-feingold-questions-obama-czars
Benen also notes a lovely bit from the press secretary…
“You know, somebody referred to in the Bush administration as the abstinence czar was on the D.C. madam’s list,” Gibbs said. “Now, did that violate the Constitution or simply offend our sensibilities?”
O Bernie – {{{{{SWOON}}}}
The czar thing is typical in its utter real meaninglessness and in its attempt to smear via suggestion (russia, totalitarian) and in its audacious hypocrisy. As the WP notes today…
“By one count, Bush had 36 czar positions filled by 46 people during his eight years as president.”
It would really be a fine thing if these people developed some integrity. But they won’t. It’s no longer in their nature.
Bernie, the Right are a bunch of nihilists.
Just look at how death-obsessed they are and always have been.
On another subject, I mentioned that Nina Easton’s extremely valuable book “Gang of Five”, which covers five influential individuals at the center of the modern conservative movement, is available online. I highly recommend this book to everyone…
http://books.google.com/books?id=i078vP9ji7cC&pg=PA136&lpg=PA136&dq=gang+of+five+easton&source=bl&ots=uYjhSwvz4T&sig=P9AL4bf1vMTOx3dGpBwfz7i16QI&hl=en&ei=sTSxStHaLobUtgPqzpzLCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#v=onepag
“Bernie, the Right are a bunch of nihilists.”
That must be exhausting
Has it occurred to anyone else that Scott C and the big Lebowski are the same person?
@bernie: “The czar thing is typical in its utter real meaninglessness.”
I thought you respected Feingold?
“Has it occurred to anyone else that Scott C and the big Lebowski are the same person?”
I think that may be mostly the case, actually. I don’t think there are half as many trolls as the different handles would have one believe.
The Mark Kirk spectacular flip flop is very reminiscent of Kirsten Gillibrand’s change of heart about gun control.
Did Feingolf protest? It’s my understanding he just asked the president to release the information which is a perfectly reasonable request from any side, though for far different motives, I’ll grant.
@tena: If you’d click the link you’d have some more info!
Senator Byrd also had some questions:
http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2009/02/25/25greenwire-byrd-questions-obamas-use-of-policy-czars-9865.html
Definitely NOT a controversy simply ginned up by the right. When Benen asks “whether news outlets will pretend this is a legitimate story anyway, by virtue of GOP complaints,” he must not have read The NY Times story about Byrd’s similar questions.
(ve vant ze money, Lebowski)
I wonder if Byrd raised the same questions with W.?
I don’t really care if they question this non-issue. I’m not a fan of czars. I wish the Democrats would quit using this Republican idea anyway.
Would a yes or a no somehow make his current concern not legitimate?
There are more than two ways to interpret asking for the information.
But I already said – I don’t much care. It’s a silly thing to get excited about and I’m not always in agreement with Russ Feingold by any means. Or Sen. Byrd.
There’s nothing nefarious about it – so why not release the list.
# Bernie Latham | September 16th, 2009 at 06:36 pm
Has it occurred to anyone else that Scott C and the big Lebowski are the same person?
@Bernie,
While his Cognitive Dissonance Detector can not display blips on the right side of it’s screen, never the less, The Dude Abides!
“While his Cognitive Dissonance Detector can not display blips on the right side of it’s screen, never the less, The Dude Abides!”
O Liam that was beautiful.
Every president since Nixon started it, has increased the number of “Czars” and it’s kind of dumb, IMO, and always was.
Not outrageous. Just unnecessary.
sbj said: “I thought you respected Feingold?”
A search high and low will not yield you any comment I’ve made on the lady.
@SBJ the difference between the Kirk situation and Gillibrand is that cap & trade is a current event.
tena – re big Lebowski…sorry, I was referring to the Coen brothers movie (the quote “that must be exhausting” was from it). I wasn’t suggesting that Scott was writing under two names. Are you not familiar with this movie? It ranks in my top very small group.
@Greg: I believe your website is still experiencing some problems. Often, from the main page, I will see that a post has “23 comments.” But after clicking on the comments link, I find only 19 comments. It will jump back and forth a bit – it seems to be “unstuck in time.”
“Any comment I’ve made on the lady.”
Lady?
Well then, do you accuse Feingold and Byrd of engaging in meaningless activities? Or … ?
@kathleen: “@SBJ the difference between the Kirk situation and Gillibrand is that cap & trade is a current event.”
Oh, there are differences, for sure. The point I’m making is that both “modulated” their views going from a district to the Senate. Nothing unique here.
Clearly, there are Lebowski fans aboard. I wonder if its appeal is mainly to liberals? Sbj? I can be a terrible bore to people watching it with me (eg, the opening scene following the tumbleweed as it rolls out to the ocean and the allusion to that theme in american myth and letters….i’ll stop now)
“{Are you not familiar with this movie? It ranks in my top very small group.”
How can you ask? I have the book of black and white photographs that Jeff Bridges took during filming.
I went in another direction on the comment.
I have a dear friend I know in real space I originally met online who uses the handle: Nine-toedNihilist.
Ha ha. Bernie must have meant Lady Di (Feinstein). Feingold is Sir Russell.
“Well then, do you accuse Feingold and Byrd of engaging in meaningless activities?”
Not necessarily. Feingold may be seeking clarification for the sake of more properly informing. Or she may have another concern similar to Byrd (or Ornstein). Being old enough to know how Nixon’s staff became immensely powerful yet outside of the loop of accountability.
The unfortunate aspect of this is the propaganda uses to which their statements will be put.
Tena – I confess it made no sense at all that you wouldn’t be a knowledgeable fan. Ibeg forgiveness
Ha ha. Bernie must have meant Lady Di (Feinstein). Feingold is Sir Russell.
It appears so.
Here’s a bit of news. Legislative leaders in Mass. think they may have enough votes in both chambers to give their Governor power to appoint an interim Senator. Bingo 60
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2009/09/16/approval_in_works_to_appoint_a_senator/?page=1
“Not necessarily. Feingold may be seeking clarification for the sake of more properly informing”
Ah, someone who is capable of seeing the obvious.
Here is bit of entertainment from Irish comedian, Dylan Moran.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlLpCh-lE54
If you enjoy him, just search Youtube for Dylan Moran. There is a lot of his bits on there.
Have a good evening all.
“Tena – I confess it made no sense at all that you wouldn’t be a knowledgeable fan. Ibeg forgiveness”
hmm, I’m wondering now if this is the possibility of frilly underthings talking. LOL!
Since Liam posted an OT youtube, I’m posting the greatest youtube ever. In my opinion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uCTJ7hkX-k&feature=related
I sent a letter off to Josh today re the disappeared Bush Legacy Project. Remember that attempt to burnish the fellow’s career, a reprise of Norquist’s Reagan Legacy Project. Given the recent revelations from one of Bush’s speechwriters, it seemed to me that the BLP had moved back about a dozen burners on the stove.
Today, Steve Benen points to a very funny attempt by Byron York to do a sort of reverse BLP – this one of the “really, we never liked him” variety. http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/ 10:50 AM
Bernie – they’ll do anything to avoid touching their own record.
And from Andrew Sullivan (nice to have him back from vacation)…”They don’t even disguise the race-bating any more”
The story was a classic schoolbus bully incident; it could happen anywhere any time and has happened everywhere at all times with kids of all races, backgrounds and religions. To infer both that it was racially motivated and that this is somehow connected to having a black president is repulsive. I know that is almost de trop with Limbaugh, but sometimes you have to regain a little shock. This man is spewing incendiary racial hatred. He is conjuring up images of lonely whites being besieged by angry violent blacks … based on an incident that had nothing to do with race at all. And why, by the way, does someone immediately go to the racial angle when looking at such a tape?
These people are going off the deep end entirely: open panic at a black president is morphing into the conscious fanning of racial polarization, via Gates or ACORN or Van Jones or a schoolbus in St. Louis. What we’re seeing is the Jeremiah Wright moment repeated and repeated. The far right is seizing any racial story to fan white fears of black power in order to destroy Obama. And the far right now controls the entire right.
Do they understand how irresponsible this is? How recklessly dangerous to a society’s cohesion and calm?
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/09/they-dont-even-disguise-the-racebaiting-any-more.html
@bernie: Re Coen brothers movies. Not a fan of The Big Lebowski. Much prefer Blood Simple, Raising Arizona, Fargo, O Brother, Where Art Thou?
Speaking of movies, Vera Lynn hit the top of the charts today for a greatest hits collection including We’ll Meet Again. Got me to thinking about Dr. Strangelove, or How I learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb. What a great movie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHcunREYzNY
We’ll meet again.
The Hudsucker Proxy, and Millers crossing are also good Coen Brothers movies.
Tena – I consider York an unprincipled jerk and quite typical in that of the rest of the National Review/Weekly Standard crowd. These publications and the folks who work within them have a propagandist function above all else. Honesty does not trump except where it serves their purposes. They aren’t vile in the manner of a Malkin or a Coulter but they’re close.
Miller’s Crossing is my husband’s favorite. We’ve been watching the Coen Bros. since Blood Simple.
I guess Fargo is my favorite, but I’m extremely fond of The Man Who Wasn’t There. It didn’t get the respect it deserved.
“* Leading liberal groups think the Max Baucus health care plan is a big old sham. ABC’s Rick Klein rounds up the reactions.”
………………………..
Max Baucus: The New SHAM WOW pitch man!
sbj and Liam – I share your affinity for those other films. They write about America and do it with wonderful brightness and originality. I think them a national treasure.
Are there any conservatives who do like Lebowski? Please raise your hands.
# Tena | September 16th, 2009 at 08:46 pm
I guess Fargo is my favorite, but I’m extremely fond of The Man Who Wasn’t There. It didn’t get the respect it deserved.
…………………………
I like it too, but then again, I like all the Coen brothers works.
I think that it is very hard to get a large box office for Black and White features, anymore. Since I am old enought to remember when all movies were black and white, I actually enjoy them.
It takes guts to put one out these days. Once in a while a director has the courage to go with their artistic vision, such as The Last Picture Show, and Paper Moon. Then of course, that director is a huge admirer of John Ford.
I love them all too – each one is so very different from the others.
‘
They amaze me.
But what happened to Jim Jarmush?
Thanks to Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes we get this…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCikSrDNuyI&feature=player_embedded
I believe that Jim Jarmusch is still alive. It is very hard to get funding for his type of work, these days. It is all based on the first week’s box office, and that audience goes for avalanches of CGI action ****.
I was watching My Clint Eastwood Spaghetti Western Triology DVD set, recently, and I was reminded once again, about how much Sergio Leone lifted from Akira Kurosawa.
I am a huge fan of the Polish director;Krzysztof Kieslowski.
If you are not familiar with his work, just do a search under his name on Amazon.
Blue, White,Red. would be a good place to start.
Also do not miss his great Polish TV series, The Decalogue Set.
# Bernie Latham | September 16th, 2009 at 09:03 pm
Thanks to Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes we get this…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCikSrDNuyI&feature=player_embedded
……………………….
That is amazing. Beck is upset at Jimmy Carter for labeling some people’s conduct as racist, and then turns around and immediately says that Jimmy Carter is just the same as the master mind of 9/11.
Lots of Beck’s followers openly call President Obama, Hitler, Stalin, etc, but Beck is only bothered when President Carter says that some racists are among those who are protesting against President Obama.
Bernie – that video – ick.
Go watch my gypsies – they will make you smile despite yourself.
“;Krzysztof Kieslowski.”
O hell yes!
I take a break and come back to find a Netflix queue!
Kathleen – yeah. This is what I call a good thread.
especially if we move on from here to books.
Ooh. Mary Travers died. 72. Time is passing!
O – no. O I hate hearing that, Kathleen.
Greg, Do you pay your techies just subsistance wages ? One time it’s x comments, next time it’s x/2 comments. This has been the case even before the “right wing trolls’ attempt to choke this site 2 days back”.
Planning to do anything about sock-puppetry here ?
amk – I emailed Greg last night when I was finally able to get the page, and I told him about the magic disappearing and reappearing comments.
He said tech was working on it. I’m thrilled I can get this page at all – I couldn’t access it all day yesterday until about 10:30 last night.
Kieslowski. I am with friends.
Anyone familiar with Dennis Potter? The Singing Detective (not the US remake), Pennies From Heaven (not the US remake, though I like that), Lipstick on Your Collar???
This guy sits at the top of my list though he worked in TV.
Satyajit Ray, anyone?
Tena – Same issues for me too. Greg really needs to pay his techies the going rate.
Also, adding tags for html codes for bold, italic, underscore etc. in the comment box is long overdue. Typing in html codes for these so lame and so old.
Am I asking for too many ponies, Greg ?
Alan Furst. Just saying. If we’re talking books.
Me: Under the Volcano, Altered States, Touch of Evil, To Die For, Manhattan, Team America, Blue Velvet, Dreams
Partner: Palindromes, Royal Tannenbaums, The Birds, Interview With the Vampire, Election, some Fellini ****
To Kill a Mockingbird, Lord Jim, Fiddler on the Roof
Kathleen – I’m not familiar with Alan Furst – what does he write?
If we’re talking all time top of our personal lists: Lolita, Anna Karenina, Middlemarch, 100 Years of Solitude, A Glastonbury Romance, Foucault’s Pendulum.
Who else loves Donnie Darko as much as I do?
Jeez – and Madame Bovary, A la Recherche du Temps Perdu and Pale Fire.
for fun I love Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman.
Fellini’s Amarcord.
That and La Strada.
O ****, and Haruki Murikami – the Wind-up Bird Chronicles and my actual favorite: A Hard-Boiled Wonderland and the End of the World.
*sigh* – I think everyone else gave up.
Good night.
Have you seen Synecdoche, New York?
Greg
Here’s one that should raise the hackles of the repubs in the a.m. Legislative leaders in MA think they may have enough votes in both chambers to give the Governor power to appoint interim Senator to replace Kennedy. That could get us to 60, but we’d have to trash the Baucus plan first. It’s even too weak and watered down for Snowe.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2009/09/16/approval_in_works_to_appoint_a_senator/?page=1
Tena, sorry. Alan Furst writes historical espionage novels, set in Europe in the run-up to and early years of WWII. He’s a terrific writer, loved by other writers and journalists. Most every time a different male protagonist gets drawn into spying. Each novel covers a different region of the tensions, or emigres in Paris with all kinds of home country politics involved, with back story as to all the other stuff that’s gone down in that neck of the woods in prior decades. Current novel (now in paperback) is The Spies of Warsaw.
His next novel will be set in Greece. I’ve read all but perhaps one and I’ve learned a lot. And love his style.
Here’s a link from the Times on travel in Warsaw, in a Furstian mood.
http://travel.nytimes.com/2009/09/13/travel/13warsaw.html?scp=2&sq=alan%20furst&st=cse
SBJ, haven’t seen Synechdoche New York but our nephew the film studies major recommends. Thanks for the reminder.
To the acorn bashing trolls here – Guess what ? You got punked.
Mediamatters
“This is journalistic malpractice, plain and simple,” said Eric Burns, president of Media Matters. “A reporter right out of J-school would have taken the two minutes necessary to call the San Bernardino Police Department and verify Ms. Kaelke’s statements. But that never occurred to anyone at Fox News before the network ran with the story. This kind of shameful work raises serious questions about the legitimacy of the entire campaign currently being waged against ACORN.”
http://mediamatters.org/press/releases/200909160021
C&L
Fox gets punk’d: ACORN volunteer knew ‘pimp’ and ‘prostitute’ were fake, was putting them on.
The only problem? It’s not true. As ACORN has stated in its press release,
“They were not believable”, said Ms. Kaelke of the two actors. “Somewhat entertaining, but they weren’t even good actors. I didn’t know what to make of them. They were clearly playing with me. I decided to shock them as much as they were shocking me. Like Stephan Colbert does – saying the most outrageous things with a straightface.” While her sense of humor might not be funny to many people, the fact is that she spun false scenario after false scenario and the videographer ate them up.
ACORN provided a copy of a San Bernardino police report of their investigation into the “homicide” of Kaelke’s husband. The police concluded, “the claims do not appear to be factual. Investigators have been in contact with the involved party’s known former husbands, who are alive and well.”
http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiwert/fox-gets-punkd-acorn-volunteer-knew
hee, hee, hee. Eat it punks.
the sound of DC “wasting taxpayers dollars” ah such a familiar sound.
Good job Mr. Dorgan glad to see someone, a D at that cares about government waste. Wonder if you are a blue doggie!
And here in the real world–
Under Fire, DHS Boss Halts Border Projects
The criticism peaked Wednesday when a senior Senate Democrat, Byron Dorgan of North Dakota, said that, despite Napolitano’s assurances, he felt Homeland Security was treating the economic stimulus plan like a “bottomless pit” of taxpayer money. It was unusually pointed criticism from a member of the president’s own party about how the administration is handling economic recovery spending.
“There’s no common sense at all to a requirement that says you’ve got to put up a $15 million facility for a small port of entry that’s host to about five vehicles an hour,” Dorgan, whose state stood to receive $128 million for checkpoint improvements, said in a telephone interview.
Within hours, Napolitano promised not to begin any new border construction projects and set up a 30-day review of how the projects were selected.
“At the end of that review, I will make all information, not involving national security concerns, public,” Napolitano wrote in a letter to Dorgan.
So far, Homeland Security has refused to release its internal priority list or its justifications for deviating from it. Instead, officials say the final project list is all they need to make public.
cbsnews.com/stories/2009/09/16/national/main5316309.shtml
Just saw an incredible documentary… http://www.afghanstardocumentary.com/
If it shows in your city, don’t miss it.
This, I did not know…
“Before Tony Perkins was basking in homophobic interracial amity, he paid Ku Klux Klan Grand Wizard David Duke $82,500 for his mailing list”
There’s a hell of a lot more of interest in this excellent piece including on the phenomenon I’d noted earlier in the shift we’e seen in the conservative activist base from evangelicals to the ‘patriot’ sector… http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_return_of_the_repressed
And Little Green Footballs is driven by the insane towards sanity… “No Racism at the Tea Party?”… http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/
Bernie:
To infer both that it was racially motivated and that this is somehow connected to having a black president is repulsive….And why, by the way, does someone immediately go to the racial angle when looking at such a tape?
As irony, Bernie, some of your stuff is truly brilliant. I mean, to write the above two lines about Limbaugh in the wake of the accusations by Dowd/Carter/the left in general shows either a staggering lack of self-awareness or an incredible talent for parody.
Are you a Rovian plant?
Bernie:
BTW…never saw Lebowski.
I am a big fan of Miller’s Crossing, though. There was a Bernie in that one, too. “Look into your heart!” Sounds like something you might say.
Scott C. – “look into your heart”…no, that would be W.
Miller’s Crossing is an excellent film. That was the work that really caught my notice. But Lebowski is my favorite for a number of reasons, not least being the hat tip to Dennis Potter’s work (but one has to be familiar with that to appreciate the presence of it in the film). My tongue in cheeck comparison of you to one of the two characters named Lebowski only has the proper comedic value if one compares me to the other Lebowski – a fair comparison (neither of us come off looking all that good). As I said ealier, the Cohens’ subject is America and I rank them, in intelligence, wit and perceptiveness, up near Twain. Do see O Brother Where Art Though when you get an opportunity. The portrayal of southern politics is brilliantly written and cast.
Re Limbaugh, race etc… you, not surprisingly in the least, presume an equivalence between Limbaugh’s race-baiting (no small record on him playing that game) and Carter’s observation that racism plays a part in what we’ve seen at townhalls, the recent march, and in more instances online that you’d want to tally up (Obama with bone through nose etc). Nothing much I can do to reframe your perspective.
“I wonder if Byrd raised the same questions with W.?”
He gave a famous speech comparing W to the Nazis, and then turned it into a book titled Losing America: Confronting A Reckless and Arrogant President. Just among other “questions” he raised about W.
So, probably count that as a yes.
Re perspective, Jack Tapper gets Vitter’s recent statements on the Acorn/prostitution matter right on the money…
“The Louisiana Democratic Party, however, points out a point of potential awkwardness for the senator — the fake prostitution ring the young conservative journalists at BigGovernment.com talked about, versus the very real ones Vitter was accused of having frequented.”
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/09/blowback-in-the-acorn-wars.html
We’ve noted here earlier the Salon piece on Glenn Beck’s affinity for the work of Cleon Skousen (one of his books now a bestseller thank’s to Glenn’s promotion of it)… http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2009/09/16/beck_skousen/print.html
As Ed Kilgore notes today, Romney has also previously spoken well of the fellow, which prompted Hemingway at the National Review to warn…
“Who is Cleon Skousen you might ask? In answering that question, it’s hard to even know where to begin. Skousen was by turns an FBI employee, the police chief of Salt Lake City, a Brigham Young University professor, consigliore to former secretary of agriculture and Mormon president Ezra Taft Benson and, well, all-around nutjob.
Of course he was also a prolific writer and likely brilliant, but Skousen is not an association a presidential candidate should loudly trumpet.” http://www.thedemocraticstrategist.org/
So, once again, thanks to Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes for their contributions to a saner, more truthful politics in America.
Well, there you go, that’s the standard liberal way to handle an erupting scandal at the heart of your political coalition: Distract attention by relaunching a personal attack against a Republican. Nice work.
Bernie:
Carter’s observation that racism plays a part in what we’ve seen at townhalls…
Plays “a part”? Carter said that an “overwhelming portion” of the opposition to Obama is due to racism. It seems clear to me that he is simply trying to smear the entire opposition with the broad brush of racism. He’s not simply making an observation about “a part” of what we’ve seen. This, BTW, is a regular tactic of the liberal left. End the discussion by shouting racism, just like Orwell’s sheep.
@Scott C. True, Carter phrased it that way and I wouldn’t have because I don’t see it that way. But I might have it wrong. Carter might have it wrong. You might too. Very difficult to measure these things.
But your ‘end discussion’ claim is ridicule-worthy. There was some sophisticated discussion in place? Perhaps, Is Obama a Nazi? Or…Does Obama have a deep hatred of white people and white culture? Or…Will socialism take over Medicare? To address race issues – to admit the continuing existence of race as it has manifested in recent events isn’t to change the subject, it is to face up to something quite ugly that still sits in American culture. To ignore it, as you are clearly wishing to do, is…again, choose your word.
Nice, easy to read chart of administrations and their czars…
http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=26964
But we ought to note that Karl Rove’s concerns about czars ought not to be passed over lightly even if, as John notes, he no longer speaks from the authoritative position of the Domestic Policy Czar.
And a bit more of the perspective thing from John Cole…
“Investigating known links to the past administration and torture- beyond the pale.
Investigating known wrongdoing within the Justice department regarding firings- partisan politics.
Investigating Monica Goodling and that entire sorry crew- unseemly.
Creating a special prosecutor to ogle Bill Clinton’s ***** and another one to fish for some possible wrongdoing somewhere in a connection to Obama that doesn’t exist- YOUR PATRIOTIC GOD DAMNED DUTY. WOLVERINES!”
And another ‘perspective’ thingey from John…
“This is telling: the David Bradley vanity project ranks the “50 most influential political commentators”. Of the first 13, there are 9 conservatives, two liberals, and two other (Tom Friedman and David Broder).” http://www.theatlanticwire.com/people/index/selected/all
Bernie:
Very difficult to measure these things.
It can be, but given the weight that the charge carries, and its effect of shutting off debate, it ought not be tossed about lightly and without substantial evidence.
There was some sophisticated discussion in place?
Actually, yes. Joe Wilson’s admittedly rude outburst was aimed at and grounded in a serious point of contention about policy…will illegal aliens be getting benefits under the new plan? Obama said his plan explicity excluded them from such benefits, and that is true as far as the language goes. But, since there was no mechanism for checking who was and who was not a illegal alien, from a practical point of view there was no way of stopping them from getting benefits, and since the Dems actually stripped out of the bill language that would have created an enforcement mechanism, it seemed that that was precisely what was desired. Hence Wilson’s claim that Obama was lying when he said they would not be covered.
This is a policiy dispute. Yet instead of trying to discredit Wilson’s take on the policy, Dowd shut down discussion of the real dispute by pretending to hear words that were never spoken in order to call Wilson a racist. Then Carter leaped into the breach by also claiming that Wilson was motivated by racism, and even widened the accusation beyond Wilson to an “overwhelming portion” of Obama’s opposition. No discussion of the actual policy dispute, just an attempt to discredit the opposition by claiming it is racist.
This tactic is obvious, and often utilized by people on the left.
Let’s distill this latest racism debate to its essence. It follows the same template as always:
LIBERAL: There is a health care crisis. Health care is a right. We must finally create a government health care system.
CONSERVATIVE: There isn’t a crisis. Some reforms would be good, but socialized medicine is the wrong path. Your plan is objectionable because it would do X, Y, and Z.
LIBERAL: Those are lies. You aren’t acting in good faith, because you are a racist.
CONSERVATIVE: Why is it racist to oppose socialized medicine.
LIBERAL: Some people who oppose health care reform are racists. They only oppose it because Obama is black and it will help black people. Therefore, opposition to health care reform is racist.
CONSERVATIVE: I oppose it on principle, just like I did when it was Hillarycare. Race has nothing to do with it.
LIBERAL: Only a racist would deny that racism is still a huge problem in this country. You are obviously a racist.
CONSERVATIVE: Why don’t you want to debate the issue, health care reform, and instead insist on calling me a racist.
LIBERAL: Racism is the issue. You are a racist.
Bernie and the rest of you can dress it up in pseudo-intellectual rhetoric, but that’s the argument you are making.
Ha QB! They just follow in the foot steps of their dear leader like good little cult followers!
Obama once lied again so he could use SCARE tatics to push his agenda.
So the natives and Obama are liars and use scare tatics to further bankrupt and destroy America!
“They delayed his treatment, and he DIED because of it,” the president said in the nationally televised address.
In fact, the man, Otto S. Raddatz, didn’t die because the insurance company rescinded his coverage once he became ill, an act known as recission. The efforts of his sister and the office of Illinois Attorney General Lisa Madigan got Mr. Raddatz’s policy reinstated within three weeks of his April 2005 rescission and secured a life-extending stem-cell transplant for him. Mr. Raddatz died this year, nearly four years after the insurance showdown.
online.wsj.com/article/SB125314896131518267.html
More proof Joe Wilson outburst was true!
Obama Liar in Chief!
@Scott – 1) discussion wasn’t shut off. Discussion on how to best manage the issue of identification while keeping the administrative costs of that down was previously, and remains now, ongoing. So that’s just false.
2) but to even argue that this is a commonplace from the left when you do so in the context of healthcare discussion, where townhall attendees were explicitly told by organizers in strategy memos to “stand up and shout” and “rattle them” etc is a stretch even for you.
3) you seem to suggest or imply that Maureen Down and Carter were motivated by a desire to shut down discussion on healthcare and turn it elsewhere. Perhaps co-ordinating with Rahm or Leftie Central? Hard to know what you imagine is the case here but if it is anything near that, we’re just on different planets.
4) you use ‘rude’ to describe Wilson’s behavior. Magnanimous of you. No reason to note that it was an unprecedented breach in that context and did occur with your first black president, nor that it came from a rep of SC, of all places. Nor his comments on the shameful fact that Jefferson did the nasty with a black and fathered black children.
so you can probably guess how compelled I am to see things your way.
Speaking of justice department firing I’m sure the elites missed this gem that slipped from the lips of Acorns CEO regarding Bush firing AG’s who would not investigate Acorn.I see Berta is well versed in playing the racists card and deflicting blame like a good little oppressive.
Once again it appears Pelosi and her gang have stepped in dodo their investigation of Bush concerning this will show their not only their ties to Acorn but their repeated blocking of legislation into Acorn and it’s shady ways! woohoo!!!!
Oh how sweet it is this is federal, state and local investigations of Acorn that has kicked off this week is going to get juicy! Over 5 states in as few of days kick off investigations. Glad Louisiana Justice Department has filed for Acorns financial books and those of it’s over 300 subgroups. And where is this blog? Talking about Joe Wilson and ignoring the possible human trafficking going on with the blessing of the DNC! Not surprising that once again the DNC endorses slavery even child *** slavery!oh allegedly they will get their day in court!
Oh what a tangled web we weave! Bernie get busy more propaganda needed for the natives to shield them from reality!
Better watch out for that bus Bertha!
The walls are crumbling down! The head of the snake is about to be revealed and the take down will finally “drain the swamp”
Even Jon Steward won’t ignore this one!
Liberty and justice for all!
msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/32884633#32884633
House Votes to Cut All Funds to ACORN
Rep. Darrell Issa (R-CA) offered the Defund-ACORN bill to the Student Loans bill. The House vote convincingly to cut ALL federal funds to ACORN
345 yays
75 nays
clerk.house.gov/evs/2009/roll718.xml
thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-september-15-2009/the-audacity-of-hos
Pelosi: ‘What did they do? They defunded it? DUHHHHHHH
protectors of the “Acorn Mafia” not “We the people”
Maryland refuses to investigate ACORN 9/09
In General Counsel: Congress Refuses To Investigate ACORN 6/09
Conyers Refuses to Investigate ACORN 6/09
Bribery Indictment For Rep. Conyers’ Councilwoman Wife
Bernie:
discussion wasn’t shut off.
Well then, at least you now acknowledge that a sophisticated discussion was indeed taking place. And of course neither Dowd nor Carter dictate the direction of the conversation for everyone. However, to the extent that Dowd and Carter are involved in the discussion, their argument about the substance was, essentially, “Don’t pay any attention to Wilson’s claims because he is a racist.” That is a discussion ender.
…but to even argue that this is a commonplace from the left when you do so in the context of healthcare discussion, where townhall attendees were explicitly told by organizers in strategy memos to “stand up and shout” and “rattle them” etc is a stretch even for you.
What do the actions of townhallers have to do with the inclination of liberals to accuse their political opponents of racism?
you seem to suggest or imply that Maureen Down and Carter were motivated by a desire to shut down discussion on healthcare and turn it elsewhere.
I believe they were, or, at least they were eager not to talk about that particular part of the health care discussion, ie whether or not Obama was deceiving his listeners with regard to illegals.
Perhaps co-ordinating with Rahm or Leftie Central?b>
No, not at all. That type of conspiracy stuff is your domain, not mine.
No reason to note that it was an unprecedented breach in that context
Well, not entirely unprecedented. Pete Stark called Bush a liar on the House floor. And unknown Democrats booed Bush during his 2005 SOTU, while Republilcans reportedly booed Clinton during one of his (not sure which one.)
…and did occur with your first black president, nor that it came from a rep of SC, of all places. Nor his comments on the shameful fact that Jefferson did the nasty with a black and fathered black children.
See, this is what I mean. All of this stuff is entirely irrelevant to Wilson’s point, yet you want to focus on it. Why? I don’t know whether Wilson is a racist or not, but let’s assume he is. Is it your contention that a racist is incapable of recognizing when the president is lying? If not, then why are you bringing his alleged racism up?
Bernie has to focus on irrelevant stuff if he doesn’t he has to admit Obama was lying as Joe Wilson pointed out to America!
Obama then continued lying and using SCARE TATICS claiming a man died due to the evil insurance company turns out that was not the case. The man got his coverage, surgery and died 4 years later as his sister testified before congress!
Obama Lies Liberals believe in.
Obama says “If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun,”
Obama “Says I want you to argue with them and get in their face,”
cool blog post. Was really interesting in general and quite much new info for me which i didin’t know before reading this.