The Morning Plum
* Eric Holder has an encounter with the 9/11 families over his decision to try Khalid Sheik Mohammed in New York.
* David Axelrod, on criticism of Obama’s failure to gain any major breakthroughs during his foreign trip: We’re not in the “immediate gratification business.”
* Tapper lists the trip’s disappointments.
* The full Senate health care bill is here, and the full CBO score is here. Please let me know if you spot anything interesting.
* Shocker of the day: Drudge is playing up the bill’s length. Doesn’t that one ever get old?
* Gallup: The percentage of Americans rating the current health care system has soared all the way up to … 38%.
* Obama needs to show results from Karzai in advance of any troop buildup in Afghanistan.
* Good read: Sarah Palin really does appear to think she’s running for president, or at least some consultants hope she can be persuaded to do so.
* Understatement of the day: Peter Wehner notes that if the GOP needs to become the party of ideas, then “Palin is not the solution to what ails it.”
* I’m with Jason Linkins on this one: Fox News’ latest transgression doesn’t seem like that big a deal.
* Joe Lieberman continues to urinate on his Democratic constituents.
* And here’s the head-spinner of the day: Karl Rove blasts the White House for…trying to manage press coverage.
What else is happening?
This blog’s homepage is here. RSS feed here. Twitter feed here. Email me here.
@Greg
“I’m with Jason Linkins on this one: Fox News’ latest transgression doesn’t seem like that big a deal.”
Well, I admit it’s not a big deal…since FOX isn’t really a news organization. It’s a political machine, so the idea of them twisting things to spin their own narrative isn’t suprising – it’s expected. The bigger deal is that they are still considered news by ANYONE in the DC press corp.
This is far from an isolated incident. This happens time and time again. That means there’s only two explinations – either they are doing it on purpose to promote their own agenda, or they are lazy and utterly incompotent at their jobs.
Either way, they don’t deserve the respect of being considered a “news” organization.
BBQ
Thanks for responding to my question. That’s pretty much the way I read it also but wasn’t sure. Surprised you could find my comment amongst all the “spam”. Regarding Stupak, it also seems that the pro-choice groups were caught off guard by it but are coming out swinging a little bit now.
Greg, all Fox has to do is send a camera crew to the signing tour, maybe they have by now, like MSNBC to see the large crowds. They’re there and some are waiting in line all night. It’s interesting to hear some of the comments from those in line.
Jake Tapper are you serious? “But critics argue all that time and jet fuel has not been well-spent.”
FIRST, is you’re going to report that “critics argue”, you should actually quote some of those critics.
SECOND, “the list of disappointments is long” YOU LIST FOUR THINGS! For pete’s sake, Mr. Sargent routinely has double that number of items on a daily basis for morning plum… that qualifies as long!
THIRD, David Axelrod has it right.
Murdoch’s FOX Republican propaganda making errors that fluff Republicans (or smear Dems) is par for the course.
It’s the accumulation of all of the little “transgression[s]” that are a “big deal”.
“Sarah Palin really does appear to think she’s running for president, or at least some consultants hope she can be persuaded to do so.”
I agree with the CW from both sides of the aisle on this one…Without some massive disruption of biblical proportion in our country Palin is unelectable for President….however…she would be an incredibly strong candidate in the Repub primaries which feature a winner take all format…in fact I would call her an odds on favorite to win the Repub nomination if she chooses to make a serious attempt to do so.
And so Progressives this is a very happy morning…an unelectable candidate who would be tough to knock off in the Repub primaries.
A second cause for happiness…even though I..like several others on this blog..and you know who you are LMAO …am rapidly approaching Medicare age…and I’m saddened by my peers general ignorance…if you look at Faux News demographics they skew incredibly older…MSNBC beats them routinely in younger demographics and John Stewart may be the closest thing we have right now to an independent source of news…again skewing younger in demographics…look at the Tea Party crowds and the disrupters of the August town halls and you see the geriatic ward…and so I wonder how QB/SBJ and othere feel realizing by demographic definition the Repubs are literally dying off…and when you realize they’ve already surrendered AA’s and Latinos…It’s a bright future for progressives!!!
Palin / Steele 2012!
Wait, even better:
Palin / Beck 2012!
@ N.R. Yes I love Palin/Beck 2012
Perhaps Greg’s blog can start the movement right now!!!
Palin/Beck – the total incompetent ticket. I loves it.
I’d say Palin/Bachmann is a better ticket.
Greg – Palin /Bachman is a cat fight, not a ticket.
What does it mean: 38% have rated HCR? I didn’t understand that.
I just watched the FOX video that falsely used Palin video from last year election to claim she had big crowds at her book rallies.
It was very deliberately misleading.
I’m puzzled why anyone makes excuses for the FOX Republican propaganda channel.
Okay, how about Palin/Liz Cheney? Or Palin/Dick Cheney? Or Cheney/Palin?
@Tena, Greg’s statement left out a few words.
I love Cheney/Palin.
My cat fight comment was a joke.
I expected an LOL.
2009 Gallup Poll:
38% rate their health care coverage excellent or good.
32% rate their health care coverage only fair.
28% rate their health care coverage POOR.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/124415/Greater-Optimism-U.S.-Health-System-Coverage-Costs.aspx
Palin / Beck 2012!
msmolly – thank you = I knew there had to be something missing. I guess I should have clicked the link.
LOL!
Grand Rapids is a VERY reichwing place. No surprise that a lot of people showed up at Woodland Mall for the book signing.
How many of y’all have ever ever been contacted by a major polling outfit like Gallup or Rasmussen?
Cause I know I never have, and I have never talked to one person who has.
Who are these people being polled all the time?
@Tena
No LOL. It *would* be a catfight. If you know cats, the image is perfect. Lots of caterwauling.
msmolly – I am over half cat myself. I understand the little frakkers. Dogs I don’t get and they don’t get me.
That’s the reason I made the joke – the two of them would kill each other eventually – are y’all kidding? Come on -
And so roughly 70% rate their coverge as fair to excellent..being generous and lumping the fairs in with the excellents…that’s still only a 70%..lump in the millions of uninsured and obviously that number drops…
When I was in school 70 was the thin razor edge between a D and an F…no matter how you slice it or dice it..our current health care system gets a resounding F !!!
Skimming that Gallup poll, it doesn’t seem that they asked the most crucial question: Have you used your health care coverage in the last year?
If you haven’t used your health care than what do you base your feelings about your health care on?
Costs? Deductibles?
I think it’s fair to expect that people that use their health care are likely to have significantly more negative feelings about their health care.
Individuals may think they have “excellent” health care coverage until they use it or until their corporate-medical-insurance company “rescinds” (”rations”) their coverage.
Could y’all imagine the First FAmily and VP family gatherings if it was Cheney / Palin? The Wasilla Hillbillies and Cheney’s stable of lesbians.
Jesus take the wheel!
“Individuals may think they have “excellent” health care coverage until they use it or until their corporate-medical-insurance company “rescinds” (”rations”) their coverage.”
That’s exactly right.
Palin/Bachmann is sexual candy for the older Republican crowd. They could have Palin/Bachmann lowered down onto the stage at the convention in Republican red Japanese school girl outfits cheering ‘Drill baby drill!’
The thing is, Palin’s zombie nation would still be claiming ’she’s just like me!’
At this point I expect a Palin *** scandal to break and her followers will say,
‘She’s one of us!’
Divorce from the first dude.
‘I can’t wait to talk to her about my problems!’
Kid out of wedlock.
‘I can’t wait to meet her, she’s just like a home town girl!’
Palin caught shoplifting at Walmart.
‘The liberal elite media needs to leave her alone!’
The more trashy the allegations, the more that come out of the word work to claim that there is finally one of them with a voice to stand up to the intelligentsia of the world! A breath of fresh ignorance to champion their class.
“Who are these people being polled all the time?”
About 1,000 people who know what over 300-million Americans are thinking.
mikefromArlington – you have managed to completely capture what the right is about – I don’t know how you did it, but you got it. You nailed it utterly.
I just watched Jon Stewart on vid explaining why he doesn’t like her and he intercut it with clips from Fox, and the things they say about her are insane and it’s just like you said, mike. *** scandal – wouldn’t phase em. Nothing would.
Palin’s people are all about: tar paper shacks, whisky and smack, one gun missing from a 5 rifle rack, somebody round here is gonna get killed, that’s for sure. Restless nights, endless fights, 100 miles an hour with no headlights…
they’ll just eat it up and ask for more.
Greg,
“Obama needs to show results from Karzai in advance of any troop buildup in Afghanistan.”
Why did you word it that way?
Isn’t it the exact opposite of what you stated. The President and Secretary Clinton want Karzai to show results before……..
Not “Obama needs to show results”. Who is he supposed to show them to, in order to get the OK to send more Troops, to himself?
“Okay, how about Palin/Liz Cheney? Or Palin/Dick Cheney? Or Cheney/Palin?”
Why not go for the Full Cheney: Cheney/Cheney ‘12!
BTW, re: the “Bill is Soooo Looong” stupid meme, the Medicare Part D bill from 2003 — which cost over $1T and was paid through debt-financed spending — was 416 pages. And that was basically just a prescription drug benefit.
More on that bill. Wiki:
“One month later, the ten-year cost estimate was boosted to $534 billion, up more than $100 billion over the figure presented by the Bush administration during Congressional debate. The inaccurate figure helped secure support from fiscally conservative Republicans. It was reported that an administration official, Thomas A. Scully, had concealed the higher estimate and threatened to fire Medicare Chief Actuary Richard Foster if he revealed it.[3] By early 2005, the White House Budget had increased the 10-year estimate to $1.2 trillion.[4]
Former US Comptroller General David M. Walker has called this “…probably the most fiscally irresponsible piece of legislation since the 1960s… because we promise way more than we can afford to keep.”"
REALLY good read at salon:
Bush’s Medicare program and the Iraq war both fit a striking pattern: The real motives were clouded in secrecy and false claims; the true costs distorted; administration officials pressured not to reveal true information; and the White House has relied on taxpayer-funded propaganda operations to try to prop up both.
The Medicare bill was supposed to be “one of the crowning achievements” of the Bush administration, the conservative Washington Times recently noted, but “so far it has turned out to be one of the messiest policies, being attacked on several fronts.” Just as support for Bush’s Iraq policy erodes over time, polls show senior citizens are increasingly uneasy with the new Medicare plan the White House insists will save them money on prescription drugs.
http://dir.salon.com/story/news/feature/2004/04/05/medicare/index.html
OOoooooo – Cheney/Cheney -we wouldn’t even have to wait for the coronation – our first Royal Family – instantly.
palin/beck = unable/unstable
Greg, What will it take to convince you that tapper, politico and drudge are not credible news sources ?
, polls show senior citizens are increasingly uneasy with the new Medicare plan the White House insists will save them money on prescription drugs.
That’s just exactly what I said the other day.
Part of the objective of the Grover Norquist revolution was to engender complete distrust in government and whether it was deliberate or not, Bush was so fraking incompetent that they achieved that goal. They totally eroded people’s trust in government.
Also, Nick Kristoff’s article “The Wrong Side of History” is an absolute-MUST-READ:
Critics storm that health care reform is “a cruel hoax and a delusion.” Ads in 100 newspapers thunder that reform would mean “the beginning of socialized medicine.”
The Wall Street Journal’s editorial page predicts that the legislation will lead to “deteriorating service.” Business groups warn that Washington bureaucrats will invade “the privacy of the examination room,” that we are on the road to rationed care and that patients will lose the “freedom to choose their own doctor.”
All dire — but also wrong. Those forecasts date not from this year, but from the battle over Medicare in the early 1960s. I pulled them from newspaper archives and other accounts.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/19/opinion/19kristof.html?_r=1
Read it all, well worth it…
How many of y’all have ever ever been contacted by a major polling outfit like Gallup or Rasmussen?
I was polled once for a statewide poll regarding the State House Speaker of that time (who was later indicted).
It couldn’t be Palin/Bachmann, they’re both know-nothings. It would have to be Palin/Cheney (Liz), with Palin as the spokesmodelprez, and Cheney running the show from the bunker.
“(who was later indicted).”
Sounds like you never got polled again.
LOL
Mike from Arlington — I think Palin would be busted shoplifting from Neiman’s. There’s no getting that girl back to WalMart.
How’s your wife dealing with Ireland’s loss in the WC qualifying? What a rip.
Kathleen – I’ll say this about that – I’m convinced that Babydick would be able to keep Sarah on a much shorter leash than John McCain ever did.
I’ve also twice been part of Arbitron ratings and once been surveyed by the federal government regarding my food shopping. That last survey was the sort that allows the government to produce regular economic statistics reports.
“(who was later indicted).”
Sounds like you never got polled again.
LOL
Tom Finneran was an arrogant pr*ck who let the power get to his head.
The state legislature in Massachusetts is held in deep disdain by most of the state’s voters (with the exception of their own legislators, of course). It’s a place that rewards hacks for being hacks.
Tena, I think Liz is already forging a metal leash out in her backyard blacksmith shed, and then later in the evening needlepointing a darling dog collar for Palin.
Evidently FoxNews thinks their video shenanigans were serious. They released a statement and are reportly going to discipline the person responsible.
.
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/11/19/fox-production-error/
.
After the Village came to try to defend FoxNews as a legit news outlet I would say EVERY situation like this one is important.
Kathleen, they were robbed!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVxJbMTIzTU
It was clearly a hand ball.
Cheney’s stable of lesbians
Wrong Cheney. Liz isn’t the lesbian; her sister is.
Mike, what gets me is that Henry knew it, admitted it, he cheated on purpose, it wasn’t an inadvertent touch, he guided the ball. And he said, oh well I’m not a ref. The officials are idiots, and I can’t believe they didn’t overrule that goal.
C’est la merde.
oddjob, I inferred from Tena’s comment that she was throwing Lynn and Liz into the stable.
Check out the fiery brilliance of one Steve Benen re: Rove’s latest batch of insanity:
At least, however, the almost farcical column is in keeping with Rove’s general m.o. Rove ran a White House that embraced a “permanent campaign,” so he’s accused the Obama team of embracing a “permanent campaign.” Rove embraced the politics of fear, so he’s accused Obama of embracing the politics of fear. Rove relied on “pre-packaged, organized, controlled, scripted ” political events, so he’s accused Obama of relying on “pre-packaged, organized, controlled, scripted” political events. Rove looked at every policy issue “from a political perspective,” so he’s accused Obama of looking at every policy issue “from a political perspective.” Rove snubbed news outlets that he considered partisan, so he’s accused Obama of snubbing snubbed news outlets that he considered partisan.
A lesser hack may find it difficult to launch political attacks that are ironic, hypocritical, and examples of projection, all at the same time, but Rove is a rare talent.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_11/021058.php
Brilliant!
“Wrong Cheney. Liz isn’t the lesbian; her sister is.”
I know that – I didn’t mean Liz. I meant the Cheney stable of lesbians and I personally include Lynn.
I mean – how many straight women write lesbian porn?
“oddjob, I inferred from Tena’s comment that she was throwing Lynn and Liz into the stable.”
You got it.
If you haven’t seen Colbert’s take-down of Palin’s book (a “steaming pile of sh*t”!), def do:
http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/colbert-reviews-going-rogue-a-steaming-pile-of-sht.php
Amazing it took so long…
“Now, though, Hoffman has announced to supporters that he believes the election was stolen by ACORN.” http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2009/11/hoffman_declares_acorn_conspiracy.php?ref=fpblg
New thread upstream.
Thx Ethan for that Colbert link. Loved it.
Ethan – LOLOLOL
“Then who the hell named her kids?” HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Thanks. I practically worship Colbert. Ever since the DC Press Dinner, I think he walks on water. I don’t get to watch him when I’m in Dallas – he’s on too late here for Mr. Tena who for 27 years has gotten up at 5 so he could beat all the traffic and be the first person in the office.
he comes home early.
A lesser hack may find it difficult to launch political attacks that are ironic, hypocritical, and examples of projection, all at the same time, but Rove is a rare talent.
He forgot to mention shameless.
Ever since the DC Press Dinner
I don’t ever expect in my life again to experience such audacious, brilliant, brutal political humor.
“David Axelrod, on criticism of Obama’s failure to gain any major breakthroughs during his foreign trip: We’re not in the ‘immediate gratification business.’
What a total joke. Well at least this site is willing to acknowledge he accomplished nothing. This is becoming Obama’s MO. Of course, we will hear from the sycophants on this site how Bush didn’t do anything either, as if that is relevant in any way.
“Shocker of the day: Drudge is playing up the bill’s length. Doesn’t that one ever get old?”
Does trying to fit Palin into every story ever get old? That is not relevant, but I still thought I would throw it out there. And the obvious point Drudge is making is that there is no way this bill can possibly be read before Reid wants to start voting on it. Of course Drudge could discuss the huge tax increases, the gutting of Medicare, the fact that a large part of the so-called deficit reduction comes from ten years of taxes and six years of service or that another large part of the bogus deficit reduction comes from making a 23% cut in payments to doctors, something which everyone with a brain knows is not even remotely feasible politically. As a matter of fact, none of the deficit projections are based on reality, because the Democratic Party knows that if it cuts Medicare and doctor reimbursements as much as they would need to for their projections to be anything but bald-faced lies, they would be committing political suicide. But naturally, no one on this site criticizes anything the Dems do or bothers to point out the inconsistencies in the bill so huge you could drive a truck of Obama-worshipping sycophants through them. Or perhaps Drudge could link to the CBO analysis indicating the public option will increase insurance premiums. Or maybe he could link to the parts of the CBO report that subtly indicate the Dems deficit cutting will never, ever happen. Or perhaps he could link to non-sycophants asking Harry Reid how a bill that proposes cutting Medicare by almost a half-trillion dollars will, in Reid’s words, “strenghten Medicare”.
“Joe Lieberman continues to urinate on his Democratic constituents.”
And if Democratic Senators from overwhelmingly conservative states vote for this bill, are you going to be writing a similar statement about them? We all know the answer to that one. Hell, a case could be made that Dems are urinating over the entire country, because more people are opposed to the healthcare overhaul than support it.
As for me urinating on my constituents, if they want me out of office, they can vote me out in 2012. I ran as an independent. Dems had a chance to vote for Ned Lamont, and he lost. And if I am urinating on my constituents, than Obama is taking a dump on his. Of course when Obama refuses to bow to the polls, the left calls it courage.
Perhaps you can take a page out of the Jesse Jackson playbook and claim that by voting against the public option, I am not a real Jew. Or maybe you can follow the lead of the anti-semites at The Daily Kos and ThinkProgress by bringing up Israel every time I do something you don’t like.
I understand you are mad at me for my filibuster promise (it is no longer a threat), but I am not going to change my mind. And believe me, if the public option is in the final bill, I won’t be the only one voting against cloture, and everyone here knows it. Why am I so certain about this? The words of Democratic Senators.
Here is Mary Landrieu on the public option:
If that’s included in the measure, it needs to come out at some point.”
Even more distressing for Dems is her recounting of Harry Reid’s response to her insistence the public option be removed. According to CNN:
Reid gave her multiple “assurances … that he’s working hard toward those goals.”
Here is Ben Nelson on the bill:
There will be opportunities to amend the legislation, and if it is amended to the satisfaction of several people, then it will have enough votes to pass on the back end. If not, it won’t”
I think we know who those “several people” are and what changes he is talking about. How long before you ***** and moan that senators from some of the most conservative states in the US are betraying their constituents? And they represent all of the people in the state, not just the Democrats.
“I practically worship Colbert.”
Remove the word practically and replace “Colbert” with “Obama” and you describe yourself, and most of the people that frequent this site, perfectly.
PS The joementum is building for the public option filibuster.
The Obama Record: Record unemployment, record deficits, no legislative accomplishments.
“I don’t ever expect in my life again to experience such audacious, brilliant, brutal political humor.”
Funny how he can’t manage to bring himself to tell even one joke about Obama or the party in power though. I think most people who don’t worship Obama or Colbert refer to that as partisan hackery.
The Obama Record: Record unemployment, record deficits, no legislative accomplishments.
Troll LIAR,
If Dems are sycophants why do we want UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE?
I want to thank right winger Joe Lie bermann for giving me an opportunity to repeatedly correct his falsehoods.
Republican Bush’s last budget was OVER A TRILLION DOLLAR DEFICIT.
If you added up everything that Republican Bush was defrauding US of the last year he was in office it’s more like a TWO TRILLION DOLLAR DEFICIT.
And that still doesn’t account for Republican Bush’s more than DOUBLING of the US debt.
Republican Math is a FRAUD.
Beyond Republican Bush DOUBLING the US debt are the uncounted TRILLIONS that his cronies at the Fed were handing Republican Bush’s corporate buddies.
But Republican’s always blame others for their disasters.
A graph of Republican debt:
http://zfacts.com/p/318.html
Those giant red lines of debt are from Republicans Reagan, Bush 1, and Bush 2.
As for Obama, he’s trying to recover US from the 2007 Republican Great Recession that was a direct result of right wing economic frauds that still have US teetering on the edge of a Second Republican Great Depression.